Coachinginterview

DECODING DYLAN JOHNSON'S SPEED-BOOSTING BIKE HACKS

with Decoding Dylan Johnson's Speed

47:55·11 May 2023

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DECODING DYLAN JOHNSON'S SPEED

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KEY TAKEAWAYS

Dylan Johnson's media philosophy: he's careful never to speak in absolutes. Always frames it as "the balance of evidence" — meta-analysis over single studies. That's why he's trustworthy when GCN-scale media isn't.
Cherry-picking individual studies to support a pre-formed view is the easiest way to get the wrong answer. Look at the body of research, not the convenient one.
Pro teams don't care about peer-reviewed data on 500 athletes. Jumbo-Visma cares about ketones' effect on Primož Roglič. They're not running studies to share — they're running them to win.
Cycling is converging across disciplines. Roadies didn't ride mountain bike or gravel a decade ago — now even Anthony has a road bike, gravel bike and mountain bike at home.
Rear suspension pressure rule of thumb: same PSI as your body weight in pounds (Dylan: 150 lb / 150 PSI). Tweak from there based on shock and feel — but stock factory pressure isn't reliable.

TOPICS

Dylan Johnson breaks down the science behind gravel bike speed, from aerodynamics and tire selection to drivetrain efficiency. Whether you're chasing marginal gains or just want to go faster on race day, Dylan explains what actually matters and why the 'spirit of gravel' argument against optimization might be missing the point.

Key Takeaways

Aerodynamics is the single biggest marginal gain in gravel racing—more impactful than weight or rolling resistance. At 35+ km/h, time savings from positioning changes (drops vs. hoods) can add up to 9+ minutes over an Unbound distance.
Wider tires are faster in gravel, just like they've become standard in road and mountain biking. A 47mm tire will outperform narrower options at the same power output—test it yourself on a gravel section to see the difference.
Tire pressure matters hugely: lower pressure is both faster and more comfortable, but requires tire inserts to avoid rim strikes. Use a tire pressure calculator as a starting point, then dial in 2-3 PSI either way based on your conditions.
Chain lube choice impacts both speed and drivetrain longevity. SRAM chains are notoriously slow; if you run SRAM, switch to a KMC or Shimano chain. Wax-based lubes and ceramic options like Ceramic Speed UFO Chain outperform standard oils.
At the domestic U.S. level, gravel is the most lucrative cycling career path right now—more accessible than World Tour road or World Cup mountain bike, with growing prize money and sponsorship opportunities from platforms like the Lifetime Grand Prix.

Expert Quotes

"If it's faster I'm gonna do it kind of guy—that's always been my primary consideration. If aerobars aren't against the rules and they're an advantage, they're gonna be on my bike."

"You can find a study to support any opinion that you have. That's why I go back to what is the balance of evidence, looking at meta-analysis instead of just one study, because you can definitely get led to the wrong conclusion."

"If you're at that domestic level in the U.S., gravel is where you need to be if you want to make a career out of it."

CLAIMS FROM THIS EPISODE

Each tagged with the strength of evidence behind it.

PRO PRACTICE
A reasonable starting point for cross-country mountain bike rear shock pressure is approximately equal to the rider's body weight in PSI (Dylan Johnson runs 150 PSI at 150 pounds), with adjustments based on shock model and rider preference.
Source: Dylan Johnson, professional gravel cyclist and YouTuber
OPINION
Pro World Tour teams (Jumbo-Visma, etc.) conduct internal performance research focused on the response of their specific star riders rather than population-level peer-reviewed studies — and have no incentive to share results with the broader sport.
Source: Anthony Walsh, Dylan Johnson discussion of pro team research
EXPERT
Rigorous evaluation of training and nutrition claims should rely on meta-analysis and the balance of evidence across multiple studies rather than cherry-picked individual trials, which can support nearly any pre-formed opinion.
Source: Dylan Johnson, podcast and YouTube methodology
ANECDOTE
Individual cycling YouTubers typically operate in the 100,000-200,000 subscriber range, with GCN as a corporate-scale outlier — a structural feature that gives independent creators editorial flexibility but smaller production budgets than the cycling-media establishment.
Source: Dylan Johnson, cycling YouTube ecosystem

KEY QUOTES

“I would say that out of all the marginal gains it's the biggest Factor you know over um weight Tire rolling resistance drivetrain efficiency arrow is the most important one for gravel most gravel races in my opinion.”
Dylan Johnson — Cycling YouTuber and gravel racer

“The speeds of these gravel races is getting so high I'm sure most of your audience uses kilometers per hour they're they're 35 to 40 kilometers per hour at some of these gravel races now so you know it's it's it it's a it's a huge factor.”
Dylan Johnson — Cycling YouTuber and gravel racer

“I think that the industry in general has gravel tire size wrong right now. Gravel tires are going to get wider and wider and wider and it's because it's faster and this isn't that hard to test I I don't know why more people don't do this all you have to do is go to a section of gravel write it at a certain power output switch you know switch tires ride it at the same power output and then you'll be surprised by how much faster you go when you put the wider tires on.”
Dylan Johnson — Cycling YouTuber and gravel racer

EPISODE TRANSCRIPT3 SECTIONS

Trust in Cycling YouTubers

If you're at that domestic level in the U.S gravel is where you need to be if you want to make career out of it are they paying too much attention to marginal gains when they should be so entertaining to listen to they're honestly there's the whole range I get pretty geeked out about marginal gains and I don't think there's anything wrong with the obviously about a gravel bike in order to UK is I was this is no offense to Lachlan thing yeah well I mean podcast yeah thanks for having me I would say you're you're on the podium in terms of YouTubers cycling YouTubers on the podium uh I mean I don't know about that there's uh a lot of us individual cycling YouTubers are kind of around the hundred thousand to two hundred thousand subscriber range and then of course there's gcn which is way way off the front um though again I mean you can't even compete with them because they're they're basically a corporation so yeah like and they're also clean shorts they're like there's no I think it's I don't know when I look at traditional media I look at the news I look at you know a lot of traditional media outlets at times not so much in the cycling space but at times I actively feel those Outlets are lying to me that there's hidden agendas in and I've talked about this before on the podcast whereas at least we're individual creators bday podcasters or YouTubers I don't watch your stuff all the time and think oh Dylan's definitely right but I never watch it I think Dylan is deliberately lying to me like I don't feel like you're deliberately misleading me I think you represent the information to the best of your knowledge at the time you create a video yeah and let me just say I don't think I'm definitely right about what I say I'm very I'm very cautious about um you know speaking in absolutes and and I hope this comes across in my videos you know when I'm talking about this the scientific consensus on whatever I'm talking about I usually try to say you know there's there's some evidence that suggests this there's some evidence that suggests this I feel like the balance of evidence goes this way or this way or there's not enough evidence but instead of saying this is correct I I'm usually trying to talk about the balance of evidence and where I think it's where I think it's leading so I hope that comes across yeah you learn pretty evenly most of the time I remember I had a podcast with Dr last Mansour he was a one of the sports scientists involved in hvmn key Town company at roughly the same time you dropped the video on ketones and I hadn't watched your video on ketones prior to the on my research and I watched it and I was like right now I hope he's just not on a totally like he's ever find a bunch of research that I haven't found and now I'm gonna have to go back and research this all again and it was basically the same so I was like all right this is pretty confident to know there's you're always going to find studies that you know if you want to go down to Rabbit Hall that will back up whatever assumption you have and then if this are gone well who funded these stories here in partially studies it's yeah it's a quagmire yeah I mean you know I I hear a lot of people say you know you can you can find a study to support any opinion that you have and then and then there if and there you go uh again that's why I go back to what it what is the balance of evidence you know looking at meta-analysis looking at looking at the studies as a uh you know all the research on a certain topic instead of just one study because absolutely if you just look at one study and you cherry pick that one study to support what you already thought as opposed to looking at what the you know the research as a whole on this certain topic says you can you can definitely get led to the wrong conclusion and you know I have the chance to chat with a lot of World Tour Reuters physiologists and stuff on the podcast and an interesting thing about the peer-reviewed data and studies that you know the masses are so obsessed with you know where's the data to show this like jumbo visma don't care about the effect of ketones on 500 athletes they care about the effect of ketones on Primos Road glitch that's it they're not testing the the entire populace don't what's the 45 year olds you know 100 kilogram loiter how's it affected him in the last era was fun though they just don't care yeah they also they also don't care to let other teams know what the effect of ketones are you know what I mean um you know they're not they're not they're not do it whatever whatever research they're doing they're not doing it out of you know trying to bring knowledge to the sport they're trying to win races cycling when I look at it now it seems like everything is merging into one it used to be these quite well separated delineated groups we had Roadies who never really got their ankles dirty and you know some outliers like Welton MVP and right across in the winter and everything they're Freaks and then you definitely didn't ride mountain bike now I'm looking around this room and I have a road bike gravel bike and the mountain bike and I'm like what am I I raced a mountain bike race two weeks ago my first ever mountain bike race so I'm gonna boil the [ __ ] I've ever seen like there's some cowboys in them mountain bike races I had a bit of punch to get into the single track first and then I just Roblox oh man you were that guy you heard that guy come on your right oh man you're probably pissing off a lot of mountain bikers out there it couldn't have been a worse cars for me to annoy people on because you can get through the single track so they kill themselves like some real Kamikaze Evil Knievel [ __ ] to try and pass me on the single track but then we got back onto a dirt road climb and so I passed in the same guys who just risked the life and limb to pass me on the single track I passed them again and it's this it's this whole thing but it's a totally different sport and I was so aware when I got into it how little I knew like a buddy of mine hit me up afterwards and he's like oh what's this what pressures you run your rear suspension I was like you're meant to run pressure nice yeah how do you figure this stuff out when you're a total newbie in it oh man I mean I don't know I've been I I started mountain biking and I've been I've been mountain biking since I was 12 years old and I'm 28 years old now so a long time um and I don't know I got I guess you learn it over time some people are a lot more geeky than others I for example you're talking about pressure and suspension I I set my suspension but I wouldn't call myself a suspension nerd there are suspension nerds out there that they they really geek out about their suspension I don't consider myself one of those I'm probably more of a tire nerd anybody who listens to one of the two podcasts that I have talking about tires like every single podcast so so what's your what's your go-to for a pressure on suspension I think that in the I mean it's so it's gonna change depending on what uh what shock you have but I think I have 150 PSI in my rear shock which is rough I I weigh 150 pounds so they recommend that you put the pressure at the same the same amount as your weight but again it's going to depend based on what shock you have yeah because I found myself bottom and Elks quite a bit now that's obviously excited very little pressure and a stock pressure is running whatever came from the factory that was the pressure all it was going away I'm blown away though but your scientific approach to gravel racing and I know most your audience I'm sure you can dive deeper you're trying to live it off air about just how intricate YouTube is in terms of analytics like I'm sure you can dive deep and get a sense of who is watching your videos but I think big data we we mainly know who's watching this stuff it's the majority of Reuters aren't World Tour top end Reuters they're a vast fast minority Mercy I always wonder with the you know push towards marginal gains and gravel which is so entertaining to listen to but is the majority of your audience are they majoring in minor things yeah like are they paying too much attention to marginal gains when they should be getting off the couch and riding their bike is that what you're asking just yeah just not ordering like a chicken yeah sure sure um I mean I think they're honestly so from the comments that I get on my YouTube channel I think there's the whole range I think there's there's people who I've had comments from people who say I don't even ride bikes but I just enjoy your videos um and I've had I have had comments from uh World Tour writers actually on my videos um I think Adam Hansen left a comment on one of my videos once and that that was crazy so there honestly there's the whole range um and I I get I get pretty geeked out about marginal gains and I don't think there's anything wrong with uh with having a bit of fun with marginal gains even when there's there's a lot of Fitness being left on the table like you could ride your bike an extra two hours a week um as well but you know I don't think I don't think there's anything wrong with uh geeking out about marginal Gaines do you think you have single-handedly slayed the spirit of gravel I hope so man I I'm getting real sick of the spirit of gravel conversation I think the spirit of gravel was born in the U.S I don't know if you guys have a spirit of gravel over there not so much yeah aerosene isn't as developed as yours and I think it's something that in Ireland than or based in Ireland than Ireland UK I'll talk broadly about them because we're roughly the same sort of population and topography of the Landscapes when we watch your gravel races like unbounds it's these amazing flash medals and priorities the reality of owning a gravel bike in Ireland or the UK is you're going to sort of a mountain so it's a totally different requirement that's not as inclusive like one of the draws of gravel is it's inclusive we can all ride it together but honestly like if you're not probably at least a cartoon on the road to make that transition over to gravel in Ireland or the UK you're riding off some pretty steep pitches um interesting and it's not just enjoyable and it's not that inclusive it's quite exclusionary based on the terrain bought so many people just are fascinated with these YouTube videos of you know Belgian waffle roads and dirty Kansas that they get mesmerized and now everyone has a gravel bike huh interesting yeah I mean so it it depends on the course here I mean we have such a variety of terrain in the US you could have uh Rolling Hills in prairies like at Unbound or you could have quite steep climbing terrain uh like Crusher in the Tasha which is part of the lifetime Grand Prix is basically uh for the pros it's an hour-long climb to start you drop down you do a small little Loop in the in the valley there and then it's an hour and a half climb to finish so I don't know how inclusive that is but um you know just give Keegan the prize money before they start oh they should they should it's the perfect it's every every race is good for Keegan but I think that race he won by over 10 minutes last year it was ridiculous geez he knocked [ __ ] out of Lachlan over in uh Cape Epic yeah yeah we were talking about that on uh on my podcast too so I was this is no offense to Lachlan Lachlan beat me at every single race that he didn't have a mechanical at last year super good writer but man if I Was Keegan like I don't and and you know was trying to decide who to go to Cape epic with and it's like okay you know we can get Lachlan to go with you I'd I'd just be like man I'm gonna stay here in Arizona and train you know is the gap that big yeah well I mean I don't I I think had I I think they had Keegan been with either Blevins or Matt beers and that was their team I think he would have won uh because he's just so I mean I just came from sea otter classic and he I mean he won sea otter uh Blevins was there um he's just he's just such a strong writer I don't I don't think there's any reason why he can't win Cape epic if he has the right teammate not presupposing his motivation but lachlan's such a huge bronze that there's maybe a brand building elements for Keegan and talks with sponsors to go and do that would like them yeah I mean definitely could definitely could it's it's interesting Cape epic most of the time uh the teams are on the you know they're on the same bike they've got all the same sponsors you know Blevins and Matt beers were both on Specialized and um and Lachlan and Keegan I think the only sponsor that they have in common is Rafa which maybe Rafa is the one that funded it um so yeah I mean that could definitely be the case I thought Alex said I was on the podcast a couple of times and it was interesting chatting to him while he was under contract with ef and then he's like get me back on like one of my contract explorers and we'll have a totally different chat with a contract expired and he said it was so difficult so you're going to you know in Unbound and everyone's like oh why is Alex I was not in the top 10 or was he not in the break why is he not in the top five he said the reality of being with ef it meant us because him and Lachlan have become this brand that woof would have a commercial they wanted to shoot in the Swiss Alps so the team would be like oh Sam Alex over there so he's flying to the Swiss Alps and sitting in like an ice cold bathtub trying to do some advert for a whoop okay an investment banker Munich wants us to do uh a riot and he's a big contributor to the team ah send Alex so he's like it could be two weeks before one of these races just bouncing around Europe going to these you know sponsored gigs and then he call comes to the race with very little proper training on real bad nutrition late nights travel not a leg and so while technically World Tour he said the last couple years was contract he didn't know what hard he was he didn't know if he was Damascus if he was the some sort of member of Staff or if he's a writer I'd imagine lachlan's kind of in that position at the moment where maybe his form doesn't represent his best winatory Utah style form yeah I mean that could very well be the case he's still he's still in great form but uh there you know there's clearly a difference between lachlan's form and Keegan's form at least with the contract that Lachlan has right now I mean you could be absolutely right about that I'm sure I'm sure EF has him doing a lot of a lot of things well like I'm going to Kenya for migration gravel race this year I'm sure he's still going to kick absolute [ __ ] out of me out there so it's all relative oh for sure yeah yeah it's all relative let's talk some geeky wind tunnel and how you did manage to kill the spirit of the gravel uh if it ever did exist in the first place you had your gravel bike or I'm on the same gravel bike as you at the moment yeah austro with a sweet machine however you find yours I love it and this is 100 the truth this is not the sponsorship talking if I could have any gravel bike on the market uh and I wasn't sponsored and I had to you know pay for it with my own money I would get the austro gravel and it's simply because it's basically the austro which is an Aero road bike with more Tire clearance it's it's like everything you want from an aerodynamic gravel bike they checked all the boxes um and then on top of that they've got the cleanest Aero bar uh cockpit setup for a gravel bike that I I see on the market so I'm super happy with it Sean Kelly you know one of the goats he has a great quote about the the best bike you'll ever ride it's the one you're currently paid to ride yeah and we're talking bringing the gravel bike into the wind tunnel and I honestly didn't understand this until I started taking parts of gravel races last year I kind of dipped the toes this year of more of an expansive calendar and in so many of the races compared to cut one road races it's almost like a time trial the amount of air I'm hitting the amount of time actually in the Wind on my own it makes such a difference to think about Arrow as opposed to just rolling around in the pack in a Peloton where you get shelter and those moments you are sticking your head in the wind they're race winning moments or on the gravel bike you know Rift last year I had a mechanical uh my do2 froze I would say I was 85 to 90 for the race pushing wind on my own it was nothing yeah yeah you're gonna be pushing wind a lot more in a gravel race than you are in a road race and and honestly the speeds of these gravel races is getting so high I'm sure most of your audience uses kilometers per hour they're they're 35 to 40 kilometers per hour at some of these gravel races now so you know it's it's it it's a it's a huge factor and I would say that out of all the marginal gains it's the biggest Factor you know over um weight Tire rolling resistance drivetrain efficiency arrow is the most important one for gravel most gravel races in my opinion you're kind of a self-proclaimed and if you go onto your YouTube channel there's so many good videos on torchoice Taurus always and it seems to be a conversation that I had Sophia Gomez on a couple of weeks ago I said it's just like every week people like water is using today whatever is he using today yeah what's the considerations when someone because we're kind of getting over in Europe and you know I'm aware that we have like even 40 of our listeners in the US as well so it's coming into gravel season right now it's not started in quite a few places when someone's looking at their event and they're thinking to themselves okay what tires should I choose for this event what considerations are you taking into mind yeah I mean there's all the typical ones how much how much road is there how much gravel is there how chunky is the gravel you know how much climbing how much descending is there single track all of that but I'm going to be honest I think that the industry in general has gravel tire size wrong right now uh and I'm gonna I'm gonna be referencing what how how mountain biking and Road cycling has come a long way in their tires in the past past few years you know 20 years ago Roadies were on what 20 millimeter tires what what were you on when you were racing with a 19 on the front on a 21 on the back and that's like the idea then like you mixed up these Tire choices well 21 to 23 was pretty standard for criteriums yeah always 140 PSI like you didn't even question that always 140 PSI yep so so now look where the world tour teams are at now I mean a lot of them are a lot of them are on 28s now and they're running what 70 PSI um so it's quite quite a bit different on the mountain bike side you know guys used to run 1.9 2.0 tires now uh you know now Nino's only on 2.4 is like that's all he runs so you know tires in both mountain bike and Road have just gotten wider and wider and wider and it's because it's faster um and I think that we're just going to see the same thing happen in gravel gravel tires are going to get wider and wider and wider and it's because it's faster and and this isn't that hard to test I I don't know why more people don't do this all you have to do is go to a section of gravel write it at a certain power output switch you know switch tires ride it at the same power output and then you'll be surprised by how much faster you go when you put the wider tires on this blows people's mind when I tell them this but but these homemade tests are unbelievable all he was getting into time traveling back in the day when I was trying to make my way through cycling and you know as Coleman tree was a broke student so I had very little gosh definitely wind tunnel testing it's not very accessible now it was a lot less accessible like seven eight nine years ago I just got a bunch of TT helmets from all my friends went up to the top of an incline locked myself into position got a push star for my body in helmet a marked it with chalk down the bottom where I stopped rolling came back up same position same push market and shock with helmet B it's pretty rudimentary but you can draw some conclusions from that yeah I'm not I'm not saying like I'm not saying this is perfect science by any means that's not what I'm saying I'm just saying if you want if you want to have a rough idea of whether something is faster or slower you know you can test it you don't just have to you don't just have to guess or just look at what the competition is running I think what most people do is they just look at what the competition is running and say okay I'll run the same thing because they must be right but so there's so many buckets there you're talking about you know the percentage of tarmac versus gravel how did how technical it is or in terms of how sharp it is puncture resistance doesn't need solid wall puncture resistance but those do these Tire choices then fall into a number of buckets for you that you have two or three go-to Tire choices or you literally playing with 15 or 20 different Tire Choice options um I have a favorite gravel Tire right now that I use for the vast majority of gravel races I won't use it for every single gravel race but my go-to tire is the specialized Pathfinder Pro and they just started making it in a 47 millimeter and that's what I've been running uh it's probably what I'll run for 85 of the gravel races I do this year and then for some of the other races that maybe have more Road uh I might run the challenge strata Bianchi um in the 40 millimeter because it's quite a fast tire but it punctures easy um so I I don't have I don't have 20 different tires I'm choosing from but I I it's more that I have a a select few that I really like and I don't have a tire sponsor by the way so so I I try a bunch of different tires and I will give you my honest opinion on them is there a big advantage to not have an Atari sponsor yeah the big Advantage is that you can run the best tire I actually kind of feel bad for certain riders that have certain Tire sponsors to be honest with you because it seems to me that there are some companies that are really nailing it on their mountain bike tire and really dropping the ball on their gravel tire and then vice versa there's some companies that are nailing it on the gravel dropping the ball on the mountain bike the lifetime Grand Prix has both mountain bike and gravel and I you know some Riders I just I just feel bad for them that they have to run these certain tires for certain races so your Pathfinder say for under 44 is your go-to 47 40 47.

Race Day Tires and Sealant Setup

So you're Embrace this white already I I I test I I test this I test this and it's faster and that blows people's mind when you when you tell them 47 it blows their mind they're like there's no way that's faster there's no way that's faster try it for yourself there's a there's a call to action for listeners now um what do you run an insiders are you going with sealant so you're going with inserts what's your your game day set up yeah I run the silke tire sealant um to be honest I think that it it's probably the most puncture resistant sealant on the on the market um there's there's trade-offs with that though it does dry out quickly but for a race day sealant it works amazing um and then I do do uh Victoria Tire inserts so when you're running low pressure which you should run low pressure because low pressure is not only more comfortable it's faster uh but when you run that low pressure you do run the risk of hitting the rim and potentially getting a puncture and silica have that cool uh I'm sure you know about it for listeners deck a little tire pressure calculator up on our website yeah that it's it's amazing how well that thing works uh I you know I'll test different pressures as well and I'll start with what silke tells me to run and then I'll drop it a few PSI and I'll put it I'll raise it a few PSI and usually usually the silica tire pressure calculator is pretty close um what's your strategy if you do flatten a race what are you bringing with you uh I got a dynaplug and a CO2 uh I'm gonna be honest I rarely bring a tube with me because usually in a gravel race if you have to put a tube in you're gonna get another flat and your race is kind of over um I don't recommend that for people I think people should bring it to but I I usually don't have you tried mock off spam product I have not I've not heard about this I've been playing Roman it's pretty cool it's uh sealant on a CO2 all-in-one canister so it's just literally I've strapped the bike the gravel bike I'm not sure if it's application on a race day because I guess you're going to have fresh sealant in anyway so if you get a slice it's kind of like fix a flat on a car right yeah exactly yeah but like they'll train them where I'm typically running wheels that maybe the sale is a little bit drier than it should be uh I get a flat on the ceiling doesn't catch you you just hit this and it's like Fresh coat sealant and the CO2 all in one go and it's like boom if that doesn't get you home it's like taxi I'll have to check that out yeah I've only started like two three months ago and it's it's pulled me out of a it just saves your day because like you know when you're yeah it's great having a tube which and stuff but uh it's [ __ ] sealant everywhere all over your hands all over your clothes yeah trying to pop that thing back on the rim it's like oh your day is ruined you know speaking of uh speaking of muck off I don't know if you caught the series that I did with Adam Karen of uh zero friction cycling no I'm saying I'll check it out the Australian guy yeah it's pretty interesting I mean he's just talking about drivetrain efficiency he's talking about he tests different lubricants and all of that um but he talks about muck off as one of these brands that their marketing claims don't line up with his test results um and Mr ludicrous Lube are you talking about this third yeah one proportionately gonna use it for the world's error record so he what he does is um he tests for longevity um and he puts the lubricant on the chain and then he sees how long it takes the chain to wear because if the chain is wearing quickly that means there's a lot of friction in the drivetrain um so not only does a fast lubricant make save you Watts but it also increases the lifespan of your drivetrain but whenever he tests the muck off products there's they don't like the drivetrain does not last long it wears quickly which means there has to be friction in the system so he's very skeptical of muckoff's um marketing claims so was there not publishing their data or they're not shown how I've never dug into a too deep I you should have him on the podcast I'm I so I you know I don't know if off the top of my head here but you he would be a great guest to have on the podcast because he can go on and on about this nerdy drivetrain efficiency stuff forever um hope hopefully the listeners are into that but yeah and it does make such a difference like there's full podcasts out there like any time I listen to Josh from silica it seems like he has endless conversations about chain Lubes versus waxes and it's like crazy how many hours can you talk so unfortunately I know yeah so so Josh has had Adam on the podcast and if if you go and listen to on the marginal gains podcast if you go and listen to those episodes it is amazing how long they can talk about chain loop I mean yeah hours like I suppose we better touch on it since we're on the subject is there a do you have a go-to chain I've been rocking the ceramic speed UFO one no you're not you're probably not giving away any odds that's a great one um that one and then also uh I've used I use silka's um silke's wax chain as well uh I try I've got a Shimano drivetrain on my gravel and road bikes so the Shimano duress chain is very fast but I've got a SRAM drive train on my mountain bike and instead of running a SRAM chain which is notoriously slow I'll run a KMC usually what's the deal with Shram like the dogs on the street now I'll try and make the slowest chains in the world surely they're ahead of product is aware of this yeah I don't I I don't know what the deal is I don't know why they can't figure that out and and what's baffling too is that uh this the higher end SRAM chains the SRAM red chains seem to be slower than the SRAM Force chains so if you have a SRAM drivetrain and you need you need to run that SRAM chain go with the force chain don't go with the red chain we do have that weird phenomenon in order areas of cycle as well where you look us helmets and there's probably an inverse correlation between the amount of cash you spend on a helmet and how aerodynamic it is like the really cheap helmets with the really shift ventilation I've seen so many studies that they perform quite well and as we started innovating we innovated more around safety and ventilation for a long time than we did aerodynamics so we actually lost a lot of those Arrow properties yeah yeah that's a great Point that's a point that Josh brought up um when I was talking to him too yeah some of these super high ventilated helmets are they're I mean that's that's not a very aerodynamic shape at all so you know and and I think they're I think they're starting to realize that because there's so many Arrow helmets on the market but uh helmets is one of those areas where it's very individual so just because one helmet is faster on one person does not mean it's gonna be faster on you and it's very hard so that makes it very hard to say that one helmet is the fastest helmet right it's just very individual well this is why I'm so skeptical of these marketing claims from specialized we're making the fastest helmet in the world like I on the national track team like I had a chance to go to the Winton or plenty of times and trying out helmets and like even from season to season as my body change shape the helmet a wasn't as fast this year as it was last year on me like it's so individual it's unbelievable so to say that one helmet is the same for me who's six for two and 80 kilograms and you who's less than 80 kilograms by a significant amount it's crazy yeah yeah for sure for sure I yeah you can't make that claim that that this helmet is the fastest um and and it's it's dubious to make that claim for other products too because the you know the whole system has to work together but we're in a space where it needs some sort of independent Arbiter to come in because you can make these wild claims like you see bikes that are going in fully production ready painted up into the wind tunnel and they're going in for tests and I was like you're not going in for testing your bike is fully sprayed open it's ready to go there's no testing getting done here this is a production ready bike and then they fire like 600 different yaw angles at this bike until they get one yaw angle that it performs well on there and then that's the marketing headline like the fastest bike ever made it's like no that's such a [ __ ] claim yeah I mean there's a lot there's a lot of ways they can spin the data to make it look like it's more impressive than it actually is the the obvious one is that you know testing it at a higher speed than people actually ride at um will you know those those watt savings will just go through the roof as you as the speed increases so you made a great point on a recent video uh I'm not sure which video might have been your aerodynamic gravel video where people that are slower make the Judgment that maybe Aero gains aren't worth it because the what saving is significantly less but they fail to factor in that they're going to be on course for much longer so a smaller what saving actually amounts to a greater overall time saving yeah so this is this is pretty shocking to people when I tell them and I had some people actually message me after that video saying I I think you got the calculations wrong and I and I said no the calculations aren't wrong this is this is correct and and actually in one of specialized wind tunnel videos they explained this phenomenon but in so in my in my gravel uh Arrow video I talked about savings at Unbound and I think I was talking about how going to the drops would save you uh nine minutes if you were in if you go from the hoods to the drops it would save you nine minutes over over the Unbound distance if you're going I think it was 35 kilometers per hour now 35 kilometers per hour is reasonable for the pros at Unbound but it's not reasonable for your your everyday cyclist who's just trying to finish Unbound so that cyclist is probably doing 25 kilometers per hour arrow and that cyclist would probably assume Arrow doesn't really matter I'm going so slow anyway but actually that Rider would save 12 minutes over the Unbound distance even though they're saving far fewer Watts they're just out on the course for such so much longer um what's the difference if someone moves down from drops onto skis Arrow bars yeah so the I believe that the drops were a 13 watt savings at 35 kilometers per hour over the hoods and then going down onto Aero bars was over 40 Watts savings holy [ __ ] that's big it is big it is Big so you know it gets into this whole conversation about Spirit of gravel and you know whether you should be running Aero bars or not um I don't know I've always just been uh if it's faster I'm gonna do it kind of guy that's always been my primary consideration one of the wildest decisions I've seen in a long time is the decision from unbounds too when I initially read it I thought I read it wrong because they stopped the pro elite Riders using aerobars but it's okay for the age groupers and you know the rest of the field I'm like I'm sure you've had the experience of being on a group ride and someone who's a newbie triathlete comes out on the group line on their Aero bars and you're like oh dude that's not safe like don't be in the aerobars you're you know you're a newbie this is like pretty dangerous stuff right and then you're adding gravel to the mix I don't think it's a great safety idea to allow newbies on aerobars on gravel like full stop but then to ban the only guys in the race who are arguably capable of using this equipment safely from using them it just seems so bizarre mm-hmm so this is I this might be a little controversial but I I will give you my opinion on that whole ruling so the the claim for Banning aerobars is safety right so if you ban the Aero bars for pros and not everyone else you've completely thrown your safety argument out the window because if there's anybody who's who's able to handle their bike on gravel with aerobars it's the pros and so so the reality of the situation is they didn't ban Arrow bars for safety they banned Arrow bars because certain Pros were whining about the aerobars for so long that finally they just caved they're like all right fine we'll do it we'll ban Arrow bars um so it it really it really was not safety it was it was just certain Pros whining about it it's been very controversial it still seems like one of those subjects just keeps on and on so last year Pete said in a sense the email to everyone prior to Unbound yeah it was if he wanted to get something going he should have started the email chain sooner because I think it was like a week before the race or something but yeah he he sent an email out to a lot of writers uh I was part of the email chain and he was saying you know let's all I I don't even think he was saying let's all not do Aero bars but he was trying to get a consensus on whether we were gonna use aerobars or not because I think Pete stetna he's not anti-hero bar but he's kind of an aero bar flip-flopper where it's like okay is it cool to run Arrow bars at this race okay oh it's not cool okay I won't run them whereas like people like me I'm just it's like if they're not against the rules and they're an advantage they're gonna be on my bike right and then people like Jeff cabush is like I will never run Arrow bars ever um so but anyway so kind of the consensus after that email was that okay we're not gonna run Arrow bars uh but then you know the the Dutch Mafia which Evar slick who who won the race is part of the Dutch Mafia um they they didn't care they were like we brought our error bars we're gonna run them you know they they didn't care about the spirit of gravel at all they were just there to win the race so so Pete stetna did end up putting these little mini Arrow bars on his bike and I don't know it's the whole thing um I didn't really chime in to be honest with you because I already knew I was running Aero bars and I didn't care what anybody else was doing like gravel is changing though and to just be stuck in the board and refused to change with it I think is a little bit short-sighted like there wasn't an incentive structure to look for these marginal gains 10 15 years ago Bravo was still is a Nishi Community it's a niche of a niche sport like let's not pretend it's you know soccer or it's American football it's still we're playing in small corner of the world but the incentives are starting to come like lifetime Grand Prix this year it's prize money for the first time and then also I know so much was made about the prize money of that but actually if you broke down how much prize money there is there it probably hardly covers your travel to the races uh that definitely didn't cover your equipment for the season yeah it's so 250 000 which is the total prize purse sounds like a lot of money and then you break it down uh and that's split amongst 10 women and 10 men so you know the that it gets to be quite a small amount and I think the winner only takes home 25 000.

Why Gravel Pays in the US

I was talking to Alexi vermeulen who got second place in the Grand Prix last year which means he would have won I think twenty thousand dollars he said he thinks his expenses for going to all the Grand Prix races and and the lodging and food and all of that was probably close to forty thousand so you didn't even break even with the prize money now that being said he's making a lot of money from his sponsors don't get me wrong but I the prize money is less impressive when you break it down for sure but what lifetime has done it's created this knock-on effect where neuter's attention on these races you know exactly YouTube series you know there's a lot of Lifetime guys have been on the podcast Us and order our big podcasts and because of that now there's dollars coming from Brands and brands are getting behind you know even stages what bike or boat sponsors on this podcast as well and it's largely because they're seeing that popping the whole gravel scene so I think lifetime they definitely have to be commanded for putting that show on kakash in because it's really popularized and given a lot of opportunities to honestly guys who couldn't have made it but guys who would have had a difficult career part if they had a chosen World Tour Yeah a hundred percent yeah I I I I totally commend lifetime for what they've done I mean they have put so much attention on U.S gravel racing with the series and and take the prize money out of it there is so much money in U.S gravel right now if you're if you're a racer that's at kind of the domestic level you know you're not quite World Tour on the road or you're not quite World Cup on the mountain bike um and you're you're in the US and you're thinking okay how am I going to make the most money which I don't think that's how most Racers think but let's just say you're thinking that um and you're like okay I could do Road domestically I could do mountain bike domestically I could do this gravel thing it's not even a competition I think that if you're at that domestic level in the U.S gravel is where you need to be if you want to make a career out of it yeah Europe's gone the same way we've gravel Earth series around Europe as well now which I think is kind of a sort of a desperate plea to copy the lifetime Grand Prix series interestingly we have more UCI involvements than you guys have in Europe and gravel doesn't need the UCI really I think the UCI needs gravel at the moment it's a weird yeah I agree yeah it is it is a bit weird and the and you know the the roots of gravel racing were very much anti-uh anti-usa cycling and anti-uci so there there is still that culture in it where you know I I think that gravel Racers both Pro and not pro they really don't they don't want USA cycling to be involved and they don't want the UCI to be involved and lifetime didn't involve either one of them with this Grand Prix and I think most people are happy about that and they'll just finish up one of your most popular videos on YouTube on time again when we surveyed the audience on email list it's a big challenge people have is either struggling to balance multiple things in their life by that I mean they're struggling with the balance family work with training and as a byproduct of struggling to balance them ways as often something they really struggle with and I know one of your most popular videos is around quoting waste for cyclists what's the core information in dust that I know that's a couple of years old now that you would still stand by or what's your amended version of that voice to people look at the chop a bit of weight now look like yeah I think yeah I think that that uh weight loss video probably needs an update because it is a couple years old but I I haven't changed my general stance on that um I stand behind a lot of the research that supports this kind of low calorie density approach uh and low calorie density just means the foods that you're eating are low in calorie density so there's not a lot of calories in a large volume of food and what that essentially means is that you're going to be eating unprocessed healthier foods which is also better for your health these unprocessed foods are lower in calorie density um and the reason the reason why that approach seems to work is because they just take up more you know they just take up more volume and leave you more full while you're consuming less calories and there is research to back that up I'm not just you know pulling that out of my ass there is research to to back that up you know give people two meals one is low calorie density one is high calorie density they consume more calories when they do the high calorie density and then that turns into weight loss or weight gain down the road um so I I stand by that approach and I think that if people are counting Cal calories or they're trying to restrict eventually they're going to fail because it's just it's impossible to live in a state of hunger you just you can do it for a while but sustainability is so fashionable downtrending everyone's like oh you know without eating pattern's not sustainable it's like okay well that's cool but also a friend of mine's saving for a mortgage right now and he saves 90 of his monthly income saving for his mortgage that's not sustainable but it gets a large Sean kakash saved in a short space of time and then he can move back to a pattern that's sustainable is there anything wrong with a similar dietary approach where it's yeah color restriction and then just going back to maintenance calories well I think it depends on what your goal is I mean is your goal to cut weight for a race and all you care about is being lightweight for that one race and you don't care about what your weight is afterwards uh then I mean I think you could make the argument for for something like that but if you want to be at a healthy weight for your entire life you need to find something that you can maintain for your entire life so I mean it depends on what your goal is is what I'd say we've such a unique relationship in a very bad way with waste and cycling I I can operate with a French team um we literally have it'd be like the FBI raid in your house like the director was forced in as unknown times searching for carbohydrates around the house and like we'd be stuffing croissants into the washing machine and putting dirty clothes in on top of them that was our Hiding Place everything baguettes croissants oil into the washing machine with turkey cash on top of them and he didn't look in there a lot of that has seeped down from you know French amateur level into you know cut one cartoon you see guys who were just totally fanatical about weight yeah I mean I so I've never been on uh on a road team like that that had that culture but I've had friends who are have have been in that culture and in that culture right now I did have a roommate who's he's a professional Road racer um right after college we would have a competition every morning where we'd weigh ourselves and see who weighed less healthy yeah and then later that day we'd have another competition to see who rode more miles that day so it was hell on the flip ended up one how high have you played around with your carbohydrate intake per hour uh during racing yeah yeah I'm usually around 90 to 100 grams per hour um I know that there are riders that are pushing that beyond that um probably something that I should play around with I if I go really high I do start to get uh GI issues so um and it when you're when you're doing that too it is important that you've got you know the optimal ratio of certain carbohydrates like maltodextrin to fructose because for example if you were to just do 100 grams per hour of straight maltodextrin you'd be much more likely to get GI issues than if you were to have um a split between the two and the optimal ratio and when you say you're 90 to 100 grams per hour are you truck and not just off the food labels are you using the you know biometric sensor like super sapiens now I'm not using super sapiens I do want to get my hands on uh on super sapiens I have used a continuous blood glucose monitor but it was not super sapiens and I didn't find it that user friendly because I could only look at the uh the data after the ride um but on that note I this is this is something that I bring up quite frequently on podcasts uh when we start talking about blood glucose monitors blood glucose monitor is cool and I think there's application for it but what I think would revolutionize training just like the power meter revolutionized training is if they came out with a continuous blood lactate monitor that's what I want to see and as soon as a continuous blood lactate monitor is available I'm buying it um and the reason is because there would be no need to ever do an FTP test again you could see and you don't even need to know what your FTP is you can just see if you're if you're um over your lactate threshold or not in real time and you can you could do a zone two ride perfectly it would be incredible yeah your gents really appreciate it um

FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTIONS

What marginal gains actually make you faster on a gravel bike?+

Dylan Johnson argues that aerodynamics and tyre selection produce the largest speed gains on a gravel bike. Factors like chain lube brand and suspension tuning deliver far smaller returns than most riders expect, and should be optimised only after the bigger variables are addressed.

Does tyre choice matter more than chain lube for gravel racing speed?+

Yes, by a significant margin. Dylan Johnson places tyre selection among the highest-impact decisions a gravel racer can make, while chain lube differences are largely negligible in real-world race conditions. Riders should prioritise rolling resistance and tyre width for their specific course before worrying about drivetrain efficiency products.

How do you evaluate cycling science studies without being misled?+

Dylan Johnson recommends analysing the balance of evidence across multiple studies rather than drawing conclusions from a single paper. Individual studies can be outliers or influenced by methodology, so identifying consistent findings across the wider body of research gives a far more reliable picture of what actually works.

Why are US domestic road cyclists switching to gravel racing?+

Gravel racing has become the most viable professional pathway for US domestic riders, offering race opportunities and sponsorship that the domestic road scene can no longer match. Dylan Johnson notes that the prize money, media attention, and team structures in gravel have grown to the point where it makes clear career sense for competitive cyclists to specialise in the discipline.

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