Ryan Mullen is a multiple Irish National Champion and one of the fastest men in the world in a race against the clock.
We "geek-out" on time trials and talk about what it takes to win at the highest level of our sport.
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Go ahead and sleep with that list until the Roadman Podcast. The big question is this. How do we use cycling as a tool to improve our health, our happiness and our long chances? That is the question and this podcast will give you the answers. My name is Anthony Walsh and welcome to the Roadman Podcast. Welcome back to the Royal Man Podcast, it's Wednesday so that means wanting it's our full long form version of the Royal Man Podcast and I'm super excited this week because I'm chatting with multiple Irish national champion, World Tour trick, Segefredo, Royal Royal Royal Royal, are Royal Mullen and it's a fascinating chat with Royal where we talk time-troyland, Royalen is an absolute specialist in the area so he deep dives into how we can get more aerodynamic and knock some time off those splits but we talk equipment, we talk diet, we talk to world horror, Irish National Championships and we even go on a weird tension about where Ryan was conceived. Yes, I shit you not. Really fun episode. Before I dive into this episode, just a couple of housekeeping things. If you haven't already noticed, I'll comment to you every weekday now with the Roadman podcast of the site to bring the shorter form Roadman Bites Podcasts. These are Bitesized podcasts five to ten minutes on every day that we don't have this long form one. So that's Monday Tuesday, Thursday, Friday. The idea of those is to give you one tangible tip each episode that you can take and you can run with. And that's based on my experience of attending personal development productivity type seminars where you take like 10, a four pages full of notes over the weekend. And then you get back on Monday and you kind of look at the pattern go, oh, damn, where do I start? I took a lot of notes. There's a lot of good stuff in here and it's overwhelmed. So I wanted to avoid the podcast becoming overwhelmed and each one of those Broadman Bites podcasts I'm giving you one small tangible thing that you can go off and you can implement it into your own trying and into your own life. So really hope you're enjoying those, bleeding my heart and soul into them, folks. Like I always do like I always do. Another big announcement I need to make is about our Patreon account. Now our Patreon account is just a link in the description down below. You head on over to patreon.com forward slash Anthony underscore Walsh. The Patreon account is how you tip your heart and say thanks for this podcast. I'm enjoying listening to it. I can see the stats folks, there's a lot more you're listening than you're subscribing on Patreon. In all seriousness, if you can't afford to subscribe to the Patreon, no hassle at all, you continue listening absolutely cost free to you. 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I'm gonna head on in to this Intimus and I use that word very pointedly and you'll see why Intimus chat with all-round TT powerhouse Mr. Ryan Mullen. Okay Ryan Mullen, welcome to the Roadman Podcast. Cheers, thanks for having me on. Yeah, looking forward to chatting Ryan. You're up in Andor at the moment. Yeah, just trying to get some altitude train at the moment to try and show the void of no racing. So yeah, it's gone well. The two weeks there in June and yeah, another two weeks now. What's Andor like? If you're anything more than 75 kilos, it's actually a nightmare, to be honest. Yeah, it's just there's just there's no flat it and if you do want to go flat you got to do about six hours a ride. So you just have to make peace the fact that you're going to do at least 3,000 metres of climbing in a three or four hour ride. Yeah, I think you're trying a bit with Willy Smith. We had him on the podcast a couple of weeks ago. Yeah, then a few rides in there back in June. He's a funny guy. Can't repeat some of the things he says. Fuck it, Repeat, I'm bored, I'm sticking under the bus. No, I can't, I actually can't. I'll get them arrested. Right, I suppose we're gonna jump around the place in this all over the place for this chat, but I wanna go back to track because it's something that's gonna on my mind a bit at the moment. A lot of people don't know, you actually had a decent track background with Ireland where you're a Fort and a World Cup out in Cali, if I remember. Yeah, that was the world in Cali, yeah. world for suit champs in 2014. That was it. My first track world. Yeah, I got into track basically to kind of fond of myself for the road when I was in 23. It's basically I'm pretty good at timed events and the criteria to qualify for the lowest level of funding when I was 18 was to go faster than like 4, 26 or 425 on the IP. So I did that and take that off and I just went through the track motions basically from my road career when I was living in Belgium with Ampost, the Ampostional Coetene. And obviously I did enjoy it like I grew up doing it like from the age of like 14, 15 at the Manchester Track League.
So it was always a better track in Maine, did a few of the revolutions in Manchester and London. Yeah, it was good. It was like more of a gateway really to me coming onto the road full-time though. Would you be tempted to have a crack off the world or a record or what you make of all the guys having a shot off that? Yeah, I would love to do the R record. I mean physiologically and aerodynamically it is possible like That's like an educator guest. That's not a any ego test look as it is educated and Yeah, one day I would like to give it a craft and it doesn't go to something ridiculous, like 57K an hour. Physiologically, I'm capable of doing it. It's just about finding the right time and the right location on the right day with the right air pressure. There's a lot of variables, but it is something that I am very interested in doing at some point. Have you looked at PowerFoilers from Caropurnaarts and Wiggins and stuff like that? I haven't looked at any files now because the Campanats is by all respects a bit of the Hobbit on the bike, So whatever he can do, he doesn't relate anywhere close to what I have to do. Yeah, obviously it's talented and it takes a great athlete to actually do 55km an hour, or 55km an hour. But yeah, we're just two very different riders, so whatever he can do, I mean I'll have to push 50 autumnal because I'm pretty much double the size, so yeah, probably looking at around 4.34, 4.44 an hour at altitude for me to try and get out of it. And what's that like a do you experience most of a drop off in your power from say, riding up the side of a mountain and or in the saddle out with a saddle versus going to a pursuit position or a TT position? Because over the years, like over a long effort, I'm way more comfortable on a TT, but you're talking about 20 minutes, 30 minutes, I can be more power on my TT bike than I can on my road bike for some reason. But when it comes to shorts, stuff like the five minutes, then you can kind of just hack away what the side of the hill or whatever. The longest stuff I've always been better always on the TT like anything over 20 minutes I can probably do like the same watts and then once it gets to an hour and way more on the TT like. Like I'm obviously a few years older than you and I remember when you were coming into kind of breaking through you're saying your name was starting to get talked about a tune you're and stuff and but I remember always thinking you were someone who struck me as you loved the kind of science of the TT like you were geeking on position and share from when you were a kid? Yeah, well, I mean, when I was a junior, like, that was like 2012 time and power meters back then, they weren't just commas, they were now, and I didn't even have a heart rate, it was trapped until I was 18. And that's when I was in Sigma, when I actually first got my first SRM. But I just, I wouldn't say I geeked out on the position when I was a junior, but I I just worked on a track with Brian Nugent when I was doing the World Cup. In one day, we put a set of bars on and I just slotted straight in and since that day, my position's not changed one millimeter. We just like, one session, we did like a 4K effort with the old setup and then we did another 4K effort. Same power but I was going like a second or two lap, one or two seconds per lap faster. We just changed the bars and the way my body like, fall it in and we thought, you know what, that's good enough, that'll do. And it's just, it's just stayed that way ever since. And I think I probably was one of the first guys to just be really arrow early doors in my career. Like I was probably more arrow than a lot of people and that kind of snuck me a few little results here in the radar. And I always wonder this, is it much of a frustration because you grow up and you're basically able to hand pick what bars you want under 18 and then you get world tour. You know, say Canyon, like, I don't know what you think on a pub, me looking on Canyon don't have the best time travel in the world. And how much of a frustration is that for you when you're looking at someone on a sort of LOP four even going fuck I'm giving away 30 seconds before we get started here. Yeah, that is a frustration, especially in trade teams. Like if I was able to like put my idea of like together, but I probably actually would be on a trek because it is good. But there's not much difference in terms of frames. It all comes down to the bars, the wheels, the helmets, can suit any position. But yeah, it can be a little bit frustrating, but obviously there's sponsors involved. And like at the end of the day, I'm paid to ride their products. So I can't grumble too much. But like for example, when you miss out on a world metal by 11 seconds and then you miss out on the European win by three and a half seconds. seconds and various other close calls. And you start to wonder, if I just had a different tire, I would have won that. But yeah, I mean, you can't, nobody has the most perfect scenario. Like you look at guys in any of us, there's something wrong there that they don't have something that they want. But so you just go around and circle's ready. So you just kind of have to make your own gap with what you have and I just come to make these stuff. But yeah, at times it can be frustrating.
I guess you're in a pretty good position with Trek now because like if you're at a boy, boy, the tracks are, they're pretty fucking top end-like. So you're not so far into much there. No, no, no, we are quite, I'm quite fortunate we have pretty good skin suits. Good how it's, good bike. The only issue now is just like, it's just like, it's always a little 1% is really, you gotta chase after like, if you're allowed to change a bear and if you're allowed to change a handlebars like with permission, of course, obviously. So I'm just kind of like, you don't want to step on me. So it's, but you've got to like make peace for sometimes you are going to get away five lots. Helmut choice must be a funny one. Cause it's so individualistic. I remember looking at pictures of you was this, we in Baku where you're wearing the bell, Javelin Helmut, like that just looks. Yeah, we used on you. That's a good memory. You got there, yeah. Baku, yeah. Bell Javelin. Yeah, because I remember looking at it because I had the same helmet and I was just thinking like, it was like you and Helmut were like fucking one thing. It was a continuous from your back straight into the head. Yeah, like Helmut's are very, very individual, like with body shape and shoulder shape and like shoulder width. So all that comes down to is like, how do you happen to like do your own individual aerofus and find out what actually is the best? But like I say, we're actually quite looking track. We have the Giro arrowhead, Obviously, like, not stepped up Jero. We can see him has a bit of a deal with him. But that's quite universally quite good. I mean, you can definitely have him much more to worse. But then there are different people looking at fan and getting 10 watts in a helmet. But like, on terms of the average, I mean, I can't complain about the Jero. I haven't actually done much. I haven't actually done any helmet testing. But it would be interesting to try and find that house. It's a part he had love to geek out like those whole boyc dudes where you're just floating around the track trying out different shit every day Yeah, I'd love to know like well like I said my position has been the same since 2014 I might have changed a few male hair in there in terms of style position but It would be nice just to like strip everything down and try and find something that is maybe 5 or 10 watts faster or whatever the hawak bike guys say I was 7 to 10 watts faster per for a gain or whatever. It would be really interesting. I was lucky. I was fortunate that I stumbled across something that worked really well for me. I just had that position for six years now. I'm not on a hurry to change it. It works if I was all for it. As time-trying evolves and now cyclists at this level evolve, basically you have to stay where you are. You have to be going about on average seven watts per year to stay where you are. Yeah, that's a phenomenal positional gains, equipment gains or training gains, then that's just a standard. What do you reckon for your average club cyclist that's probably listening to this? Because I know a lot of them. Like they're obsessed from watching fucking GCN and their brainwash by power to weight. And you're trying to like I'm trying to knock it into their heads all the time for TT. It doesn't matter. It's like coefficient of frontal drag and power, attitude, things are looking up. But they've almost a lot of them anyway have no grip on what arrow and what's not arrow Is there any kind of like pointery if you give them a easy way to get arrow An easy way to get arrow Basically Yeah, what's the kilo don't matter a foot for time-trialing like literally like I'm an 80 kilo rider I don't do six watts per kilo ever like a time traveling page for me is probably over an hour 5.2 5.3 anything short you talk in five and a half Well, I obviously as you're if you're a smaller dude like a climber you then you can actually do six watts per kilo But for me that's 480 watts that's six watts per kilo. There's 480 watts like it's It's the two don't go have to get the two don't go hand-on-hand the time-tron unless you're doing a hill climb then it does matter but But the biggest thing is just your head. You can go as high as you want, but then just drop your head. That's probably the easiest way. You had the most unerigant on your body. Frontal area, your head takes up most frontal area of your position. So if you go, if you went higher by five centimeters, but you're able to drop your head by seven, then you go on faster because your head's in a low position. Yeah, I always think glad to just, you need to take photos and just get a mate to fill them here and just look her back and go, David Miller, I don't know, time-trial thing with him. And he had a quote, and it's so easy. It was just like, if it looks faster, it is fast. And I think a lot of time, that's right. If it looks faster. Yeah, basically. Yeah, it comes down to comfort as well. You can go, but you can go extreme and get really air. Like, I made that mistake. I actually tried changing my position over the winter. And it didn't work. went to I got more aerodynamic than I couldn't do the power anymore. Like the hip bangludes got closed off the bits in much and then there was just mistake so I went back if it's not broke don't fix it I just got a bit greedy and tried to chase 10 watts which I found but then I realized I was losing 20 in terms of the power up because I couldn't do it so I was going 10 watts slower so not necessarily if you look fast it doesn't mean you are going faster it comes down to like anything over 20 minutes like you plug 10 that's when comfort kind of starts to become a factor.
Like four capers suits, for example, you can go extreme there because only four minutes and you can train yourself to be uncomfortable in four minutes. But over like 20 minutes, 30 minutes, 40 minutes, you need to kind of vary and take into account being comfortable on the bike and being able to actually produce power. So yeah, there's a trade off, you've got to find the balance between aero and power I'm not a bad bastard, magic. Ryan talked to me about the Jiro Natalia, your grand tour debut. What's that like? It was good. It's a bit like being here. If you're over 75 kilos of space for just a 21 day orax, you start the race. You think, where's the same place that you can get spat here? Because that's what you have to work out. If you get spats early, or even there, you're not making it to finish. So you have to like kind of survive one or two climbs within a few minutes of hell of time and then chase back in the cars, or like just take maximum risk and almost end your life down and just send the cuffs back up. And then, yeah, you just have to have a bit of a bit in talent. But I really enjoyed it. It changed my body as a big guy. Like it slid me down by about two or three kilos. Like my natural weight before I did the Giro was like 84 and a half, maybe 85. And I'd race it about 80, 73, but since the Giro, it just shaped my race way it became 80. But it was good. It definitely, it's kind of a strain, because at this stage now, I should have had three grand tours in my legs as opposed to one. Last year I got injured. I had 10 tonight, so I had to miss the Vuelta. And then this year I was going to the Giro again. But then the calendar changed because of the coronavirus. So now the Giro and the world are both classic to classics, which I'm needed for. So I'm the only other grand total, I could have done with the sort of France and I wasn't in this office selection for that. So it's kind of a bit frustrating. But it is nice to actually have a grand total of legs and know that actually I'm capable of completing one. Because like head screwed on and on form, there's a scenario where you could take the jersey and hold it for maybe the guts of the force weak at a tour. like does not many lads in that position? Yeah, it would take like a big commitment and it would take like a lot of work. I mean, the best athlete from the world goes to the Tour de France and it all just so happened to nail that peak right for those three weeks in July. So it's easier said than done, but it's just like to win a world tour time trial these days. It's just, it's no longer the strongest man who wins and that's what I've had to kind of have to make peace with. They can do the most watts, but then if you ride it, not very intelligently. For just like even a snippet, like just 10 seconds, you go too hard somewhere, or you get one corner wrong, that's your shot of glory gone. So it's just, you just have to have one of those days now where you just nail everything right, and then if you go as well, you'll win by five seconds. Big amount of margins are gone now. Like, how much prep is going into a say a prologue like that for you? Are you running through Google Maps every corner? Are you going pre-reiding the course? Do you have pacing strategy set out? I mean, I don't, I've never had pacing strategies. And if something I'd like to look into, but I just, I always go, I go out hard and try and hang on. And if I do hang on, that's the day I went. If I don't hang on, then, oh, it didn't work. So I would rather, I wouldn't like to leave it up to a computer to tell me what I can and can't do. Because on the day that I can do more and the computer is telling me I can't, then that's the day that I'm ahead of fall off. Because I probably feel finished on this that I could have squeezed 2% harder and then I only lost by 5 seconds. So that would be my head in. So I just came off deal and kind of based off the time that I can do what I can do for 20 minutes, what I can do for an hour. and then I take an educated guess. And I just know from trial and error over the years, like what some of my size with my aerodynamics needs to do on the flat to be competitive and what they need to do on like a 5% drag to be competitive. I was going to say, have them played around with like best bike splits? No, I haven't done any of that. No. It's, it is something I'd like to look into, but I think like, I mean, yeah, maybe one day, I don't know. Like it is insane, Leachra, like we've been, because they're taking tells and the data points and are plotted against the gradient or plotted against wind directions on the day. And so they obviously have all your power foils for the last few months. And you can even tag power foils that are important ones. But like we've had clients and you're able to predict their 25 mile TT time given the wind conditions and everything to within six or seven seconds. Like it's fucking insanely accurate. Really? Jesus. Yeah. It's way more. It's work playing around with. All right. Well, I'll kind of that the same, man. Yeah, definitely have a look at it. If you want to, you know, if there's something that you want to bounce off me, I think my message is on it. Let's talk about the world in Doha. That was a big, big, as well as, like, as Irish lads, we all knew who you were.
You were known in the Sawickland circles, But you really borced onto the mainstream international, I suppose, when you were sitting in that leader seat for a while in. So, what's your- It's a fifth, doesn't it? Yeah, fifth, yeah. What's that like? I'm still clinging on to that as well, I'll probably cling on to it for the rest of my life, actually. Don't do the intermission in the roadman boys podcast. I'll kind of miss my little- sound effect. Very professional, I know. This is our intermission in our Long Farm Roadman podcast. This is the time where we all take a little collective exhalation, but it's also the time where we stop procrastinating and we head on over to patreon.com forward slash Anthony underscore Welch. And we buoy the good host of this show, a coffee or a beer. And we say, you know what, chap, you're the good man. And I'd like to buoy a coffee or a beer. So head on over there now and get the deed done. Let's jump back in and chat with Ryan. No, I was really good. I didn't go into that world with any expectation. If someone said to me beforehand, you're going to come top-twining today out of him like, sad. I have to look at that. That being my first elite world. But that particular year, I had a lot of health problems. I kept getting sick because I was a new work, like I was setting up as a Neo Pro into the world. I just I overcooked it in the winter big time and I just never really came right. That's when I started to understand like what fatigue actually felt like. So it took a really long time to get on top of that fatigue and correct my iron deficiency that I gave myself. So yeah, I didn't really start coming good until probably August time, like it started September, I got the tour of Britain. Like I had like two big stage race in the legs before dower, I did an echo tour and the tour of Britain. So I had like basically 14 days of race and plus the Europeans in the middle of that like 15 days of race and within about 20 days. So I think that definitely like gave me a big boost of form. But even still I didn't expect to go in, I didn't go into dower, hoping for a top 10 or even like a top 15, a top 20 would have been, would have satisfied me. But then I just did all the right training, like spend like 10 days after Ennekoto on the TT bike, just nail and threshold intervals, doing work in the sauna, doing TT intervals in 25 degrees, wearing a gabber jacket, knee warmers. Just like that went to that extreme. Like I didn't mind, because I was just going in, like this is the first night I just prepared like in the lead TT, I thought really. So I was just going in like, big green behind the ears and I didn't know what to expect. I just so happened to run on a dual carriageway. And I love that. I just like a TT way. You don't stop pedaling. You're just on the pedals. There's no rhythm changes. And some people hate that. Some people love it. I just happen to one of the guys that love it. You just get into a routine and a rhythm. Bear the head. And then, yeah, that was it. it and then somehow came fifth. And there's a big, the quote I love and it's like success leaves clues that we can look back on stuff like that and we can go, okay, well, you don't tend days before in the TT position, you two stage races in a two week period. Do you look at the data from that and you go, okay, I'm going into this at a minus 40 training stress balance? Is that something you geek out on or do you leave that to the coach story? Um, like, I do look into it, but I don't let it define how well I'm going. Um, as a general rule of thumb, like on training picks, my fitness is 120. And then my form is plus 20 around putting the teams, like I'm flying, basically. And that's kind of what I was, that's kind of what I am at the moment. Um, in and around that anyway. I don't like, like I said, I don't like computers telling me if I'm going well or not. It's all about feeling and it doesn't take into account like any emotional or mental stress that you have to take on board and like if you're a racing but then like, you try and then please says you're flying and you're nailed to training and your peaks just banged on right this one day. But then I found my member dies like before. You're obviously going to be so you're not going to perform. I don't like for that reason. I don't like I don't let that dictate if I'm going well I'm up. It's more of a combination of getting confidence from like doing good numbers and training or having a good race or doing a I don't know good TT somewhere or like at the moment I've been doing TT is on Zwift and It's just like it's just getting Getting the kind of doing a confirmation ride We've seen the what's go up and body weight coming down that everything's going well are you seeing on Zwift I see him as Alex Deus, the post that's in. There's a lot of guys in Swift racing have missed our world for our calling. Seems like every calf fork can do six watts per kilo on Swift. Ah, the box. Yeah. Like I was doing as with it. I mean, I mean, I was with TTT with a local group a few months ago. And I was fucking hanging on for dear life. Like I'm 370, 380 in the wheel. Like getting twisted. Meet the same guy as like a month later for a group, right? They can't do it, like. Yeah, there's a lot of lying going on on the old weights and stuff. I've been doing these Tour de France things and we kind of christened it like weight doping.
So actually, for these virtual Tour de France races, you have to send a picture of you on the scale of CODS and then they submitted that to Zwift. So luckily there wasn't any of that going on. Well at least I hope not. It wasn't a lot going on in the virtual Tour de France races. Yeah, it's John the Nicholas Roch last week and I was trying to get to the bottom of it because he's very competitive. It's like, have you got your weight in it like 40 kilograms in them with traces or what's going on? Yeah, it just kind of suits the climbing time trial and type because it's just sustained power. Like in the whales you are doing, you're literally, for me, like in the bunch and with, you're still 7, 3, 3, 8, 3, 9, 4, 100. Like last week on the Sunday, last Sunday, I did 4-10 for an hour and that was on the trainer in 30 degree heat on my balcony. And that was the last...after I got dropped on the last clock because I did that stupid attack before I realized this is where that algorithm doesn't take into account so break So I was doing like 4, 64, 7, like 7 or 8 minutes off the front and I got caught. That was like 6, that was like 6 was the key left for me. And I was watching the was the key to everybody else on the side. They didn't even get within one lot of the key lot. You got somehow I saw that brought back so then I was just like, they cracked. I was just like, I've got to waste that energy and everything. I was like, I end up 190 heart rate thinking, how are they catching me? Like, yeah, I'm talking about this because you never like when we're watching TV or you know, even if you're in your own and you see lads out trying, you never know who the sound lads are in the world tour bunch. You know, in any group, you know, even the bunch in Orleans, you know, there's a group of sound lads that always have good crack within the race and then there's a group of lads who are just pricks and you're like, I'm just staying away from them. Give us the inside Let's go over here. Who's the sound lads and who's the pricks in the world? Who are a bunch? I mean, anyone from the Southern Hemisphere is sound of my books. I get Aussie's, Kiwis, they're all good. They're all good laughs. They just have the banter. They'll like a bit there. And anyone who's less than 60 kilos is no friend of mine. That's a nice way to break it down. I've seen you and Taylor Fini were good mates, us in. Yeah, he's actually okay as well at the moment with his girlfriend. with his girlfriend, Cassia, they're staying about 10k off the further of the hill than I am. Yeah, we got on really well. When he came to Canada, I was actually really nervous about meeting him because he idolised him for a good few years after I've been under 16 to junior, under 23 senior, just like, oh, one day I want to go to the table. Next time I'm like, I'm rooming with them in stage races. They just put the two heavy units next to each other and everybody's gone on so well. I mean he taught me a lot about being 80 kilo plus in the world so on how like what you have to do and like you just taught me a lot and like just said don't go chasing being light because that's not where our strength lies. If like you have to work to your strengths and my strength was just power. Like a loss for him there's no point trying to like lose five kilos and then lose your power. It makes you pretty much redundant. Yeah you can hand on like five more K-off or 10k client but what else can you do? You still average, you may as well have one unique selling point which is going to guarantee you race wins or contracts down the line and trying to worry about fitting in with the rest of the skeleton men children. Well that's it. Like I'm not sure how well Mitch Docker brought you out to him on the podcast a few weeks ago and Mitch was talking about how he just had to really look at what the team needed and he's had to reinvent himself a bunch of times because just like you were saying there, he's like, there's no point in me being, you know, average in everything. I need to just completely niche down and go, this is what I bring to the team. I'm going fucking full gas and delivering on this one thing. If they need me on the day to do this one thing, like I'm brilliant at it, but I'm shitted everything else. But then that changed through his career. And he went from like lead out man to the dude who had started to get over the medium mountains to you know full on domestic roles but it's changed for them. Do you envisage that being something that changes through your career? I got what I went to the trek. I went there as a TT rider and then pretty quickly I I nested it in with the classics team and then I was required to like do a lot of positioning in the classics and the big classics and that kind of took a lot of that took a lot of firepower. Again, you kind of, basically I became, I did become kind of like some model lead-out guy the first year I was in track. But I wasn't through a conscious decision. That was just like from the work I was having to do in 70 race days. That just kind of somehow changed the kind of ride where I was. I was doing those like one or two minutes, ten, six, seven, eight hundred watts. I had half sprinting into corners and I'm kicking out of them. I just kind of took the edge up the TT. And I wasn't a consciousness, and I just happened, but then.
So in 2018, I'm a bit of last year, my role stepped away from being a full on-time trials, because then I wasn't going to be any good at doing leadouts. I had the team for some big results in the classics and then in certain races with Yasuo be in his Ludo guy. It was never a conscious decision to change it kind of rather it was, but it has been a conscious decision this year to go back to the rider I used to be. Because even over the winter this year I tried to turn myself into more of a classics rider and I just turned that up and just got this sprint on me. Then my engine for TT just got deleted off the face of the earth. My 20 minute power dropped off by like 20% and then put my sprint for like 10 seconds, just like in the 1500 watts average, or maybe even like high like 1600 z. I got a really good sprint, but then I just lost all engine. So I just got over the course of lockdown. I hope until now I've just been getting the big engine back and it's so fast on really well. So what's the typical week look like Jordan lockdown, trying to always for you? Jordan lockdown, in terms of hours I was doing about 13, 14, 15, big week would be 16. And I was doing double days just an hour in the morning before breakfast to burn off fat that I was accumulating somehow. And then in the afternoon I was doing like two hours with some kind of effort to kind of keep me saying, because I can't just ride on the turbo. I just have to hurt and make it feel like it's what I'm doing is worthwhile. So it became anything from like doing like engine build and workouts like three times, 20 minutes and 380. CT work out like three times 10 minutes or four times 10 minutes at like 42430 And then just like strength intervals like like 20 minute blocks of 50 rpm 350 watts is it my that so that's kind of what I was doing the entirety of lockdown the numbers yourself cool Don't they when you're 80 kilos like if you're a 60 kilo rider tell them the numbers just sound shit Yeah, like when I saw I get for example when Mike would one that at the one on Tuesday to the virtual store. You've won with like, you had six, what, 6.7, what's the kilo average of the client? And that was like, I think that was 400 watts for him. And I was like, Jesus. Like that's still my zone three. That's high zone three. It's fucking nuts. Rusty's a good man. We had him on the podcast at oil ago as well. He's a funny fucker. He's a great guy. I did a big ride from there back in just after lockdown, we'd end up May, started June, I was like six and a half to seven hours. He's a good dude. I raced against him for a year in Canada. And I was telling him the story. I don't even think he knew it at the time. I drove from Toronto out to Quebec to do a race. It was like a seven AM start. So I got about two hours lead before the race. And it started like right at the bottom of a fucking wall of a climb. And he whacked it off the start line. I was literally back in the car, drove him home like 45 minutes later. Yeah, it's funny how different riders can do different things. It's crazy. Just physiologically, it's impressive what each kind of rider can do and can't do. How much are you looking to nutrition on? Not a great deal, to be honest. I just know over the years what I can and can't eat and and I can't get pissed. Of Willys Maresall seems to be big into it like we're chatting and we're going deep on ketones, fasted rods, depletion rods, all this type of stuff. Have you got into any of that sort of the dark signs of it? I've done fasted rides and I haven't done for four. I didn't as a NeoPro because I was big and chunky and my team wanted to slim me down but home only that's terrible for you. And like I say, like being a a bigger guy you thrive on having lots. Go and do fasted rides, all you're doing is to be pleading yourself when you can't do what anymore. So I'm a big believer like fasted rides, I've heard of fucker bollocks to be honest. We work with some guys, some guys might like him but fuck that, I like food too much. And what about a supplement regime? Do you think any supplements? I just take iron because I naturally have quite a low iron. I have to like take a supplement just to stay on top of it. But that's it, that's it really. Bit of caffeine before TT work. I do load with nitrates before TTs, big TTs. Not every TT but big TTs. That's like the beetroot juice. Cause that, like it doesn't work with everybody but it's just one of those things that for me it does work like nitrate load and I'm beetroot juice from like a week or something before, a week out from a TT and I find that helps. But then- Try bike loads. I do do bike carp occasionally. It just depends if I can remember. I got them terrible to remember to say things like bike carp and then I've been told take Peter Allen because it's good for TTs, but then they got to take eight tablets a day for like eight weeks. Jesus, I just forgot. I just don't remember to brush your teeth at night so I never mind take eight pills a day. What about painkillers? Trab it off. I know Nico was talking about taking trab it on TTs. No, I'm one of the TTs I don't take anything because it's weird, I like to feel. Even on the track, I wouldn't take bike hard because I just go too hard and blow myself to pits.
So from the TT point of view, I actually don't take anything to norm anything. I'll do the nitrates. I'll do bike hard if I remember. But I just like to feel because on my trail, I don't take the stuff from training. So I'm gauging how I'm feeling in a TT after what I've done in training kind of thing. So for example, the Nationals is generating out on back dual-carriage-grade drag strip. Like, I'll average 4, 40, 4, 30 or whatever. But then, if I go and take, I don't know, someone can numb the pain, I'll probably try and push harder, but then physiologically I can't go any harder, I'll just blow down the line. So for that reason, I don't take anything, I just like to feel the in control, even though it's fucking uncomfortable. Like, I just still know what it feels like, and I'm just used to what that feels like. So, what's the best sense of kind of a bit of the control through. What do you think of the painkiller culture in South London? I think it's good that it's stopped. It wasn't necessary. I don't think, I mean, giving guys the same medication that you got when you just fresh out of the femur operation. I don't think that was very wise. Obviously it was pretty rife and it's like a few years back now. Luckily I can't miss the major part of it. But I've always been on teams that are pretty on the ball and don't do it. So I can't comment too much on that. Because it's funny isn't it? Because it's that line like it's not banned and that's why you know, Rochi and stuff is happy to talk about. I think he's on an article of chemistry he talked about. about it. But it's like the difference between legal and moral, I think is where it starts getting a bit cloudy. Yeah, I that's the thing. I missed like the morally wrong standards of cycling and I'm quite grateful I did. Obviously, I'm pretty sure there's still people cheating and flicking the system. But I The cycling these days a lot like a much cleaner thought and I think it used to be I wasn't in that area So I can't comment on what it used to be like. I don't know what people are doing I don't know how they did things. I don't know how they got away with it So I actually I'm completely and I'm just much in the dark as you are I do use here the word cortisol being thrown around all the time Even still But I don't fucking know what that means It's actually in it's fucking notes But when you listen to the lads like I just toyed our Hamilton on the podcast and like that was like I heard an interview with you where I was doing the research for this podcast and you were talking about the tour of Britain saying like you hoped you didn't knock one of the the writers off because you're like used to seeing them on the telly and now you're right beside them. Kind of had that moment chat with Tyler Hamilton on the podcast. I was like, holy shit, I'm chatting to Tyler Hamilton. Like I used to have a picture of me bedroom with Tyler Hamilton. This is weird. You got a picture of your bedroom with me? I do. It's a different type of picture Ryan. It's like Okay. It's a game horn tribute. The lander style. Right, let's jump on the training for a little bit. You're normally based out at your own, are you? So I say that again. I cut off a little bit there. You're normally based out at your own for a training? During the winter months, yeah. But I became a resident of Antora in the last August. So this year I've got to spend a bit of time here and I was ready to take a step where I wanted to try and just like look under a few more stones and stones of altitude kind of thing. Because I'd open till June I'd never done an altitude block. I tried to do one last year in front of me with the national team but I was only there for a week before I got called down to do the tour more so that got caught short. So I've actually never had a stint long without the altitude to see if it worked for me. So that was kind of the attraction with me coming here to Andor. I just felt like being like time traveling and climbing would go very similar kind of efforts. So it works the climb as a shrub look for time travel. And that was the logic behind me once I like take the leap and come up here. But yeah, in the winter, like right now I'm looking out and I can see a ski lift. That's how high up it is here. And I don't plan on being here when there's snow. So growing a world for being home during the winter months. and then when I can't appear, I'll be okay trying to become a climber. Do you have a training group up there or are you heading out on your own? There's a few guys around. Yeah, a lot of guys right now are on different camps. Like, on the same valley that I am now, there's the Israel Star Wars Nation team, then higher up there's Bahrain and there's movie star. So, there's a lot of guys who I'd normally would ride with are stuck with team commitment to the moment and then there's a guy or two in from like Livinio, other places like a lot of my teammates now are actually in Isola 2000 and things sell San Paolo Greeno initially during the Grand Tour training camp. So some of the guys I would normally ride with are actually away. So the last couple of days I've actually been training solo, which actually I don't mind here because that means I get to climb at my pace, which is a lot more comfortable in that pace. If you head out on your own, on the Listen to Mu, obviously you listened to the Row Man podcast, but apart from that, you listened to Mu, so what?
You listened to that? I can't even sleep without listening to the Row Man podcast. No, I actually don't train with music ever. The only time I listen to music is on the table trainer. And I was kind of drilled into me by my dad when I was younger. Because his, one of his best friends was killed listening to music on the road, because he couldn't hear the traffic. So I don't do that. I don't listen to music when I'm riding. I just have enough to focus on. Stop for coffee? Not as much as I used to just to try and like get that actually little stints of endurance. This day at this time, time of place I stopped the coffees at on rest days or if I'm doing a big day like six hours, I'll stop after I've done the work after like four hours and I'll just ride home to I was kind of thing. But if I do have a coffee, I like to kind of earn it. I want to stop really nearly cause I see in the espresso logo. I go, sometimes I don't want to stop, especially pay I've noticed, I haven't stopped much of pay, I think I've stopped once for coffee. Because I don't know, just up here, for whatever reason, when I was stopping out of coffee, I just can't go in again, I'm absolutely fucked the rest of the ride. It's always a bit sad when you have to stop for coffee on your own as well, it's just not the same crackers and the lads are waiting. Yeah, exactly. Exactly, yeah. Exactly, yeah. In Gerona, I stopped a stop affair there, but up here, I just try, I'm all on my, I'm up here to work, I'm up here to get the benefits of the training, the altitude, I may as well do things properly. Come out and stretch, film roll, go to bed, drink water. Here's the fucking big question everyone has been tuning in to listen to, what is the best coffee shop in Gerona? There's a few good ones now. La Fabrica used to have the Monopoly, but now there's a fewer up top top. And now there's obviously a... Fabrica's price. It's expensive though. That's the price now. They set the standard. Like, that's the same price. They do want to get good coffee in Jordan. You have to pay $250. And people will argue with me like the men's bags where you can still get a piece of copper after they get it done. They're weak. They're also different. But, Cargot Coffee's coffee, I mean, 250 is not expensive for coffee, in my opinion. Yeah, it's Dublin Price and Star, it's Paris Price. I remember going out to Toronto, I've been going out there, I signed for a French team in 2000. Fuck, I'm showing me here in 2012, I signed for a DN team in France, and we were trying to come down near Toronto. I fell in love with Toronto then, I've been going back on a two, three times a year since. I think Fabrico was probably the only spot around for coffee that was decent when it opens. But I think what's the one on the main street now on the Rambla greens? Coffee greens, yeah. That's a pretty good coffee that I thought. Like there's a few, there's like this is not with coffee greens, there's a new place called Blend. And personally, I think Blend is the best coffee in Jourona. Right, we're going to get out for a coffee right. I'm just going to come along so you don't have to fucking see, you have someone to to talk that the coffee stops, you don't look awkward. But you're not going to turn out me for today. Before we finish up, I remember back in the day, Mike Barry was riding for Sky. I have mentioned on the podcast a couple of times, Mike was coaching me. And it was, I don't know, it was one of those moments where the ball just dropped for me and go, Oh shit, there's a bit of a process here and there's a bit of a system. Like before I was just doing random shit and then Mike taught me like no, does it assist him to stop trying to need to do one certain days? Well, I remember sitting down in his gaff in Toronto and one of the questions he asked me was, he's like, if we sat down like three years from now, five years from now, what has to happen in all that time for you to look back and go, you know what, that was fucking kick ass. Everything that could have happened, that was amazing to me happened. What's that look like for you in a sort of three to five years? time scale. That's a good question. I've got one finished business with the European Championships and the World Championships. Obviously the absolute dream would be to get the triple like National Europeans and Worlds and if I could do that I'd retire that year. I did that this year. I don't see it. I grew up with time trownd so no matter how much I try and send myself into a classics writer, I'm always going to want to win T to use that's just my ambition. About two top five, I think it was a fifth and last but fifth or sixth, I can't remember. I two top five is the Europeans, the fifth in worlds. I just think I'm on the right day, on the right course, I can't actually win. So it's just the case if I come together, but yeah, that would be the ambition, just like knock off the Europeans. Worlds are different story, it's obviously is much higher, you don't get any easy worlds. But yeah, that would be gone in obviously. I mean, if you wanna throw in piracy ban now, and go ahead, why not? I'm glad to hear it's ambitious, because often I chat to, obviously a lot of world tour will go in the podcast. And often if you look back, when I'm doing the research for the podcast, I listened to them five years ago, 10 years ago, and they have this swagger about them.
They're like fucking Connor McGregor 10 years ago, and the world is at their feet, and the world tour jades them. It just takes that edge off them. It takes the confidence off them, and they're kind of like shoulder slumps going, oh yeah, like I'll fucking hopefully get another contract. And so it's good to hear you, like a bit of fighting the bellies there. Yeah, I mean, if you go in like a lot of cocky little shit and then you realise how hard the world for us, then you're gonna leave us all your tell to your legs. Well, I got the hit by the shit you got on me every race I go to. So it's just the case of like picking your days and like, yeah, you can't go into every race thinking, no, I have todays, but they can't be like a cigar or an alkalie or a valverde where you just fucking rock up to race. Alright, I probably come seven today. All right, I'll do. Whereas 99% of the time I'm just struggling to get around and decide the best of the time limit. So just like, you've got to go through a process I think that's the key to like being having a healthy mind and the sport is like, you use one race to build, use another race to build a little bit more, have a little train and block recover, then you pick you one day race or then you pick your TT or you pick your stage race where that's where you're going to go. Because you can't mentally burn I go into races knowing I'm going to get the head kicked in, but I know it's a great good. Like, for example, poll and people that want to go and fly and prove that they've worked the best over lockdown, I couldn't give a fuck if they've worked the hardest because there's still three months until the classics. That's the way you've got to look at it. It's all about perspective. You know, people, if you win any race these days, you're going to get a new contract. that incentive but I think it's a lot of a bigger picture being consistent better two months down the line when you actually want to be going well and you actually do go well as better for your head than just picking up a seven place or a fourth place there because you keep too soon and then you'll shut it when it really matters. Last one for you, yeah because I know you got to get off. Are you coming home for nationals? Yeah, yeah I will be. Yeah, although I just got I just I found out the dates for European TT champs. The TTs around Kilnestin area, I think, on the 20th of August, and the first I think from memory. Then the European TT Championships are the one day after the road race, and it's in book, nowhere in France. It takes like two days to get there. It looks like I might have to miss the road race, which is a bit of a shame, because I do like doing it. Yeah, it's a cool course for you. I'm gonna go out and wreck you to TT in the road course next week, but they're both pretty much running Molongorces. Alright, let me know what it's like. Because I was made in Kilnesson. I left my dad's sack in Kilnesson. It's a beautiful romantic story that the people of Kilnesson are kind of... It's warm listening to that. Ryan, if anyone's listening and they want to hear more about you leaving your Dazsack, what's the best social platform for them to follow you? So I was there again. If anyone wants to hear more about you leaving your Dazsack, where should they follow you on Instagram, Twitter? Yeah, both handles the same, just at Ryan Mullen and I. Ryan, it's been a pleasure. Yeah, thanks for having me, mate. Good chat. Good chat. Well, well, well, folks. I really enjoyed that chat with Ryan Mullen. It was just like chatting to one of my mates down the pole of our one of my mates out on a coffee spin. And yeah, he's a humble down to earth lad, but don't let us humble down to earth nature. Foodly a demand is an absolute hit around. Like we just go there, who knows where everyone will go. We take tour of the France jerseys and hold them for the first week, Yellow jersey and hold them for the first week. Like potentially see that under horizon for a moment. But who knows, a lot of water under the bridge and a couple of seasons, especially in a sport like errors. Folks, I really hope you've enjoyed the Rob Man podcast. A couple of asks on my end for you. If you're enjoying the podcast, please do me a favor. Help me spread the good word. Get the link, paste it into your Club WhatsApp group, put it on your Club Facebook group, tell lads out on training spins and screen capture it on Instagram and tag me in it and share that's one way I know that this kind of viral nature of spreading. That's very watch appreciated. Secondly, keep saying that liquor broken record, head on over to patreon.com or the slash Anthony under Skollwatch. And I don't normally say this on a Wednesday, but I'm going to say it this Wednesday. I'm going to chat to you tomorrow.
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