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Cavendish Accused: Did He Hold onto a Car in Stage 15? | Tour de France 2024 Stage 16
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Welcome to our special roadman tur to France live podcast for stage 16 stage 16 and it was a Sprint stage potentially Mark Haven's last ever Sprint stage in the tour to France we had High Hopes but they didn't transpire today we're going to talk about bam G crash yasper Phillipson is he the most dangerous Sprinter in the world is the green jersey battle back on but top of the show we're going to talk about some of these allegations that Mark Havish held on to a Caron to Plateau De Bu just before the rest day so let's dive into it Sarah Anthony yeah so as you mentioned there we kind of like to do a little bit of a Roundup of Gossip salacious gossip that's been going on online since our the last stage we had a rest day yesterday which was uh I think somebody coined the phrase as it's a truce for one day which I love but yeah there's been Rumblings online that basically a lot of people have been kind of saying that Cavendish was holding on to cars up the last Climb On Stage 15 and one tweet that I picked out in in particular goes Cav not even four minutes slower than Jorgenson and 8 minutes faster than Fang yeah no way that's legit only 10 minutes slower than the pantani record there has been a bit of discourse online about C have cheating holding on to cars because it was very touch and go when we were watching the stage they had a graphic up as to how far behind the winner you know the the head of the The Paton Cav was and we were all like Wily won't he make this he still has I think he had 16 minutes left to get up that climb which is no no no he didn't no it's it's a 50-minute climb it's that's what I'm saying but he only he had he was running out of time rapidly okay let let me jump into some of the stats on it so it's a plateau de it's a 15 .8 km climb from bottom to top so it's 7.9% gradient so for context Pacha Rod it in 6.98 watts per kilogram for 39 minutes and 50 seconds which is insanely fast and du today we're asking people to throw in and multiply their weight in kilograms by paga 6.98 and it ends up being a crazy crazy number we did m m 7 million wat for9 minutes yeah but you would expect L you would expect sprinters to lose roughly one minute per kilometer going up a climb like that so you would expect Cavendish to be 15 16 minutes slower than Pacha so some of the comparisons that we're seeing here like Jorgenson what was he said that tweet he was only four minutes slower than yon yinson rode the first 5k to climb and then sat up and drank a kind of coke and probably had an ice cream going up to climb and Fugal sang like 8 minutes faster than Fugal sang Fugal sang probably stayed with the bunch all day and then you know cruised up the last time he had no incentive he wasn't pushing for time cuts and the 10 minutes slower and Pan's record sure it's a totally different set of uh conditions that they're going up in like is it a different wind that day is there different equipment that day so to break it down and show you some of the stats on Cav cavendish's Ascent so pantani was indeed just under 10 minutes faster than cavish so pantani took 45 minutes and 45 seconds that was in the 1998 tour to France by contrast Armstrong was in around that as well took him 45 minutes and 30 seconds back in 2002 so Cavendish he was only 15 minutes slower than Pacha going up the climb that's what we said we'd roughly expect Cavendish to lose 1 minute per kilometer it took him 54 minutes and 51 seconds that's an average speed 18.25 km per hour or 4.66 watts per kilogram to go up to climb that fast which is well within the Realms of Mark cendes to pull out that sort of Clan at the end of a stage like that like i' WR up at a 4.66 at the end of that so there's no nothing the DAT supports the Cavendish held on to a car whatsoever had any sort of mechanical assistance going up the climb so it's just blatant Twitter speculation but also like the thing if we even if we didn't have any of this data which I think it's pretty conclusive from that data to
Say Kish had no motor assistance going up the car but like we got pictures of a guy trying a packeted Doritos at Pacha the other day you don't think what everyone on Plateau de if C the we'd have a video of C the I trolled the web and the dark web for a photo you wouldn't need to trol it like if there was that picture there it would have been front of cycl news C think about right Cavendish has broke the record he has this Legacy in the sport now it's going to endure well past the 2024 tour to France do you think he's going to turn a that holding onto a car going up a climb and get thrown out of his last two I don't think it's beyond the the the possibilities that he did it so I know I often talk about the couple of times that we were at the tour people who are struggling up the climbs they're getting pushes from The Spectators they're having okay but you know what I mean they're getting pushes from The Spectators they might be having like an extra long sticky bottle or something and no one really Minds I as you said the the time Cut's not there to knock people like cend dish out it's more to make sure that people who are genuinely very sick and can't go on are eliminated from the race that's just cheating like you can't hold on to Caron climes that's just cheating whatever about a fan pushing you or you getting some mechanical assistance coming back if you've had a flat tire like there's Unwritten rules in cycling I know coming back from a flat tire or you know you change a bike and you're behind the team carard that's technically cheating but anyone who's been around cycling long enough everyone turns a blind eye to that fans commissars everyone thrs a blind eye holding on to a car going up a line is black and white it's cheating c will 100% not do that in a race like the T of France also like I just don't get how people think there's not going to be pictures of it or how there's not a commissar with them going up the climb or how Matt Stevens literally was on the motorbike the entire climb with cavish Matt Stevens is not going to r on MAR cavish I think we can put that on I think so let's let's move on from there okay so a little bit of a few comments from the writers after Stage 15 we still have yon's finger guard who's over three minutes behind pagach he is still coming out with fight and talk he came out and said I will simply not accept this result he basically V to keep on battling on for the CH of France yellow Jersey and he said I'm not going to accept this result I won't go down without a fight I've won the CH of France twice I'm not here to ride for second place I'll do everything I can to try to take the victory so there you go it sounds like he's disputing a election result there with Mele in Balance I will not accept this result I think he's going to have to accept it I don't have as much there's no way that he can get this time back over if you you've had a look over the next couple of stages you don't think there's any way that he can get back to him we can have a a quick look at it they it's a hard last week they're heading back to the Alps for sure but I just and there's a lot of climbing but bacha's the Gap has got wider as the stages have go on so like we'll go through tomorrow stage towards the end but looking ahead to the upcoming stages yeah like there's a lot of climbing on stage 18 Again stage 19 has two horse category climbs stage 20 the queen stage probably some really Clough climbs in there like called the Trini cat On's there three cat ons before a cat one Hilltop finish you to say it's over but it's is getting stronger like if the bookies are really really heavily weighing a pagach win here yeah okay and then something else I found on that I thought was really really interesting Tobias johanneson he's the you know ex Mobility writer who was ahead of Bacha and uh vinard On Stage 15 he was a little bit further up the climb and when when he was asked about when he got passed by the two Lads he said when
Those two guys went past me it's like I don't even do the same Sport AS them that's how quickly they went by him and he was just like X-Men didn't goast hold on to the car okay so let's dive in and have a look at today's stage 16 T of France as we said potentially Cav his last ever chance to sprint in a t of France has it been 100% confirmed that he's finished next year I know he is finished next year but has he actually come out and said he's finished uh I don't I actually don't know I meant to ask you that and pose that question to you earlier because he I mean I'm sure he could potentially come back I think he's done done isn't he he's done he's done you can even tell the way he's sprinting at the moment he the day after he got the record he said he woke up and cuz Grant Thomas said to him in the bunch like what are you doing here today why didn't you just quit and he's like I have too much respect for the race but he said he had a feeling of like and now what and you can see that in the final of the Sprints like when it starts getting a little bit hectic he's just like you know what I've rolled that dice of chance one too many times I just don't want to do it again so today stage it was 188 km finishing in y we had one category climb today it was a cat 4 climb it was 1.2 km long 5% gradient and it was 76 kilm in the finish and it had zero effect on today on today's stage today's stage was a real one where you could kind of get along with your day you could probably fullon watch whatever Netflix show you're listening to yeah today was not like that no today I suppose the feature of it was 10 roundabouts in the last 10 K that was the main kind of thing that would have been getting Riders nervous and I know we were talking a little bit about apps that Riders are using uh because you were what was the app you were asking about my my epic ride is the app that a lot of riders are using to figure out win directions and that was kind of maybe something that was causing a little bit of tension so just the two apps there's Vel viewer at Larry War B mentioned in commentary so V viewer will give you like Advanced preview of what the roads look like so if you're coming in through a town you go oh it looks like it's tighten up there there's a bridge there it's pinching there it's essentially like Google Street View but all the teams are using the same app so they're all getting stressed at the exact same time because if a bridge looks like it's pinching all the directors are saying to their team you need to be in the front so there's this big swell to the front but how Okay so yes they're using apps that essentially give you kind of the pinch points in the wind direction but does somebody go and do a Ry or do I know the Riders the mountain Riders will know the climbs quite well but they will go into do they Vel it won't give you the perfect side like we've used it in lead outs before and it won't give you the perfect side of a roundabout to go so if you go left at a roundabout and the shortest way exactly that the only way to do that is actually be at speed and like we were in for SCA over at the Tour of France in one of the lead cars like seen our driver he's an ex a deser rider and he was just railing the roundabouts on the wrong side of the road cuz the roads were closed so someone like that then would report back to the team cars and say round about with 8K to go stay left round about sevenk to go stay right so they're writing this down and then they're feeding the real time back to the Riders but yeah that was really when I was looking at the stage in advance the kind of noteworthy thing it wasn't the climbs it wasn't the wind cuz the wind didn't blow today it was position through those roundabouts before we jump in to talk about how the whole thing unfolded can we just do a brief bit of business uh the podcast and the show on YouTube it's
Only possible because of our amazing sponsor what bike who sponsor today's episode I used to have such a nightmare coming home from work and trying to take the legs of a turbo trainer trying to fold them out from a closet trying to take back wheels off getting oil all over my hands what bike simplified all that I just jumped on the bike it's ready to go connect to Ruby zift whatever your favorite virtual platform is you're just up you're ready to go in seconds what bike have an amazing deal for anyone who listens to the podcast use code roadman r o a d m an TN a check out and you're going to knock 10% off your W bike when you go to w bike.com back to the business love hate relationship with the w bike it's G it's staring at me over here I haven't been on it in a while we have one here in studio yeah okay so how the kind of day unfolded before you get into the Sprint and the exciting part there was one mad lunatic out there out front for AG Mission suicide mission so this was Thomas ging in sorry I'm sorry I'm so sorry I've butchered that name from Direct Energy but so can you explain to me why this guy would have chosen this okay I I know we spoke about breakaways you want to get your jersey out there you want some uh TV exposure for your team why would he go out and spend all day out on his own it looked like such a long boring day he was doing average speeds of like 43 kilometers an hour and stuff but what what is the motivation there what's the tactic well he didn't have to share the TV time with anyone right okay absolutely no chance today wasn't going to be a bunch Sprint so not a lot of people were motivated in the third week of a grand tour to go up the road when there's zero chance to he would have been hoping Somebody went with him though he was yeah like so you got to think of the teams that wanted to put someone in the break so you've GC teams no interest in putting someone in the break you've Sprint teams no interest in putting someone in the break so then you have your teams who've got very little out of the race so far so you're looking at teams like bahin in teams like that so they're thinking okay we need to put someone in a break what are the chances of a break going to the finish today a chance of a break gone to the Finish practically zero so not a lot love for that so he would have attacked hoped that one of other teams that were motivated for a breakaway went with them and then looked around and seen the bunch just fanned across the road and thought Oh no this is going to be a long day but like he stuck with it it was a real Hail Mary but he stuck with it like he didn't get caught until about I think 25 and a half kilometers to go and then they they swallowed him up he had two and a half minutes on them for a while so I mean I guess why not why not yeah wouldn't be for me no so we got into those final 10 kilometers as you'd expect the pace just goes up and up and up it's like a pot on the boil the temperature just goes up and up and up my heart rate goes up and up and up and that in my stomach goes up and up and up as well so really the only thing I've note in the last 10 kilometers was that bam Gade green jersey scored a Sprint points leader crashing and he looked in a pretty bad way coming across the line he's visibly caught up visibly shaking Before the Race everyone was just saying okay Benny all you got to do now is get to Stage 21 in nice and finish and it's it's tied up just don't crash stay healthy stay safe and then I don't know I think we all kind of Jinxed him because this happened yeah cuz there's such a there's such a gap as long as he was sprinting and getting he didn't have to win stages but as long as if Philipson's winning he's coming second toward for fif you're still picking up points and the Gap was unbridgeable there but with him crashing out and then Phillipson winning and getting 50 points it's Throwing It Wide back up
We'll look at that in a second but it panned out really as a quite chaotic unorganized Sprint at until Uno X took it up we had a massive turn from Magnus Court leading four uno X guys seem to have control of the front of the race but alpus and theic just sprung really late with Vander Paul as they've they've just practiced this so so much now Vander Paul's coming so late with philipson in this wheel and when he comes he's coming so fast that everyone's just pinned so whatever position you're in if you're in wheel two to wheel 10 you can't move like we' seen uh conard from kofus trying to move open close that Gap or wed let a gap but it just wasn't possible because Vander Paul's gone so so hard and ultimately he took up that Sprint with probably 350 M to go and the way the roundabouts were positioned you couldn't actually see the Finish Line until 200 meters to go so by the time yasper opened out and he closed the barriers again and you know yasper he's yasper disaster they were calling him but I call him yasper deviation Philips he never Sprints in a straight which you know I think sprinting is an art but he pushes it more to you know he yeah he really kind of moodies the lines there it's all very gray and I as we watch it I I was like he's definitely going to get pulled up for different you didn't see like cuz I actually thought of that and when we initially talk about what we're going to talk in the podcast a lot of stuff I want to say is around that deviation but then you seen it from a different angle and you're like it's actually a pretty clean Sprint it's definitely clean by asper standards there's a few things okay so as the lead out was happening they were coming more towards the line I was like Anthony what is going on here because we had a youo x Rider at the front it was all in one single line so we've got a youo x Rider then we have a alason rider then we have match vanderpol then we have yasper and then we have a unox rider who's Kristoff right he's Uno X's Sprinter and I was like why Rider leading out alaan like why is he at the front surely he should he should come off that lead out train because he's giving the alasen guys a free ride now I know he's obviously trying to work for Kristoff his teammate but surely Kristoff can stay in the lead out train you know the alerson lead I train it just seemed really bizarre to me yeah like I've seen people talking about this online and the problem is this all happen so fast and really unless you've been in the Leo you don't understand how fast and chaotic all that is and split seconds like a split second hesitation and you're getting swamped so one of the main things you want to do is give your Sprinter a chance to Sprint so the Uno X guys yeah it's not ideal they prefer to have their two guys directly in their wheel so they can lead Kristoff out perfectly but they look back and they're not in the whale it's like well what are we going to do now are we going to ease off the power because if we ease off the power you know in theory someone will say okay well why don't you just ease off the power and then you put the alpas and guys into the wind ear and then it m times their whole Sprint the problem with that is like that's hindsight in TV where it's you feel like you can slow down reality if you hesitate for one second there you get swamped from behind wel wins that stage or someone coming from behind takes that extra momentum and they past you so it's the important thing is still just giving your Sprinter a chance to Sprint and by having it lined out like he's not Kristoff's not getting boxed no one's coming up and giving him pressure on his right and his left so at least he gets a clean Sprint and like he did get to Sprint like where did get he got he got a Podium out of it yeah he got a Podium I don't know it just seemed like I had enough time during that spring to say to you I don't understand what is happening here I honestly think that that lead out Rider is going back to the steam bus and
Getting a bit of a spanking because I don't know it just it seemed like he gave y bro and M MVP was literally just chilling all you can do is keep the Pace High at that point because if he checks to go again it Sprints over if he checks and gets off the power for one second his races run he's not getting off the power and back up the power cuz the momentum's coming from behind yeah so you mean get back up the power so his rider can get back and his get comes back onto his wheel he gets back up the power he checks to let to force alason into the wind the idea that he's going to be able to check Force alason into the wind and then start the lead out again for his lead out man like it won't happen they'll just get swarm from behind yeah I just thought maybe he should have just he just should have just rolled off and Christof his guy should have stayed in the alerson Lei train and then come from behind but look what do I know someone who is not on the podium Kim forth s Bennett what is going on with s Bennett this CH of France it's best result yeah it is got 60 to day yeah so what do you think is going on in D cathlon with him I mean or is it just Seas Sam it's just I don't know it's the the life cycle of a sprinter it seems like he's on the way up be gmet uh I can't remember the last stage beanie won but I just remember the contrast so vividly in my head where Beanie came up to Bennett and it might have been stage 14 whatever the last Sprint opportunity you had when beanie won beanie came up beside Sam Sam's in the shelter beanie leans on him puts Sam into the wind beanie wins the stage and I'm like I remember vividly Torah Brit quickstep having a lead out for viviani viviani was on the back of the quickstep lead out and he's about to launch and this upstart comes along 19yearold 20y Old from on poost S Ben knocks viviani out into the wind huge Superstar at the time viviani like a world tour Rider a t tier Rider on post from a continental level Rider comes along knocks him into the wind benett launches wins the stage and then benett goes on to be you know one of the greatest our sprinters ever well does that hunger that was there then I'm not sure if it's there now he making a lot of money over the course of his career he has a kid he's married he's living out in Monaco he'll say all that stuff doesn't matter but I don't know how does it not matter that's the fascinating thing about Sprints my favorite shot of the Sprints is like the Drone footage basically from the top cuz as you're coming up to the Finish Line it's frightening as you you always point out Mark AES he bosses like there's people shouldering him he's leaning against people like he's practically sitting on another person just to get them out of the way to get through these tiny little gaps and for Sam Bennett like I can totally see why as your career goes on or that just that little bit of edge you might just second guess yourself risk reward risk to reward exactly so look I hope I don't think there's any more opportunities for Sam to really Shine for the rest of the tour but H best luck to him so today finished out with yasper philipson winning the stage Philip bhouse from Bahan Victoria second Kristoff third Bennett fourth W vaner who has had a great Tour by his standard so I I did read today that white vaner and mat vanderpol I don't know if this is spin from their teams but they say that they're peing perfectly into for the Olympics that's you know no that's not SP they're trying it makes sense yeah so I mean fifth on a stage when you're just kind of this is training you're peeking you're you know in a training block white is a beast so today's conclusion for me is the green jersey botle is a little bit more open I don't want to say it's open it's a little bit of a Peak open than before the stage before the stage you would have said the door was slammed short it would be the robbery of a lifetime if you asper and took the green yeah I think he's gone down a lot
In people's es not that yeah well that as well I really like beanie as well yeah of course a lot of people didn't really race beanie they thought he was like you know kind of a fluke looky coming into the race yeah and now he's just blossomed throughout this CH of France so that's been brilliant to see so there was an 85 point difference between the two of them going into today's stage for in the scota green jersey classification and there's 50 points for the stage win so yasur got 50 points and beanie scored zero points so now there's a 35 Point difference between them and we have Sprints intermediate Sprints coming up you wouldn't imagine either of them are going to get to the finish on any remaining stages for a stage win so we're really just looking at the intermediate Sprints now the intermediate Sprints are scored differently depending on if it's a hilly stage or if it's a flat stage so the remaining stages are all classified as hilly Sprint stages so first place gets 10 points six points Four Points so you can see it's difficult to accumulate 35 points without J rer scoring because you know even if yasper is winning it and being his only role in for in it that's only a six point difference and he needs to accumulate 35 points and we have one opportunity tomorrow uh which looks like it's decent there's not that much climbing before tomorrow so that could go to like the both them could be there sprinting for that but then when we roll onto stage 18 the Sprint point is after two third category climbs you'd imagine their boats still going to be there for that one stage 19 the Sprint is basically at the start of the stage they'd be there for that one stage 20 it's a right off the Sprint is after called the Trini and a cat two before that so there's no chance they there for that one so they've got one two they've got three opportunities to Sprint and 10 points maximum available so 30 points if you didn't score any of them you would still say it's unlikely it's unlikely unless jper pulls out and right of a lifetime and gets to the finish in one of the stages which looking at them like you know tomorrow should we're going to tomorrow stage now so tomorrow stage is 178 kilometers it's starting in s Paul TR chatau and it's finishing in so du vulu beautiful that shocking pronunciation Anthony has thisio Anthony has on that written fically and uh I going to put this I'm going to put it on Twitter later if anyone wants to see how Al has fically written this so for de Vu Lou E so the mo have a native French speaker pronouncing this we do have a native Portuguese speaker over there in the corner he's been no used to us pronouncing this useless so like tomorrow there's no way Jasper is getting to the Finish because we have the cat to uh called the Bayard and that is coming after roughly 134 km then we have the called the Neer which is 7 km 7.5 km at 88.4% even if he got over the Catu there's no way he's getting over that and the cat three to the Finish which is 3.8 km of 5.9% so it's just not going to be a day that the sprinters have a sniff potential day for the Breakaway you know pugy doesn't need to get any more time you would say yonas has to try something unless otherwise distorted France is over okay so a couple of questions around this I just quickly want to go back to this green jersey fight and is there any circumstance where teams team directors and mates and teams will start talking to let's say aon's team will start talking to you know X and be like okay don't contend or please contend all of the points or let's see how this goes so points fall on my favor for Sprint none of that stuff goes on at this level there's too much like deals definitely happen and there's clicks and there's you wouldn't realize there's like the Monaco click there's the shirona click there's the Andora click right but that sort of stuff is too big you know people need to fight for own dinner okay okay okay I trust you I trust that that's that's it's not going to happen anyway the mats don't work it doesn't work okay perfect okay and then second question is do you think now that uh the GC is done and dusted sorry actually before
We move on to that I want to just do get a bit of reaction from yasper philipson uh so yasper after the race said I was feeling good I had a good rest day and I felt that my shape was improved during this tour to France so I was confident that we could line if we could line it up today we would go for the win every stage win is really hard to get at this level so to take three is a really good job and I think we can be proud and then he said everything is possible but it's really hard he said gmet is climbing really well I just hope he's okay after the crash because he doesn't deserve to lose like this we'll just try whatever we can but hard stages are yet to come we have to go day by day but we mostly enjoy this win and some of the commentate the pundits on Eurosport I think it's Danny she said that the next couple of stages will sue GMA little bit better just in regards to his climbing abilities and well like Su rela not having to battle the time cour he's not getting to the finish in any of these stages that was kind of those those comments from as were were kind of lowkey and nice I mean he's hardly going to say come out and say I'm delighted he crashed out a kilometer from the Finish only chance of win the green jersey is if beanie doesn't get Denise yeah that's his only chance and to be honest like to answer your other question as well is the GC done and do that I think Gus's only chance to win this is if pogy doesn't get toise because we go TR to GC T Pacha 66 errs in seven minutes yonas is three minutes and N seconds behind him Remco 519 the podium looks a lock there uh unlucky for the ASO because they obviously would have loved that drama going into the final weekend RAC and so weall glue to it y Almeida looks pretty solid in Fort he's a minute OD clear and M Landa who fifth but they're both domestics for Podium Riders Rodriguez absolute nightmare for our inos granders is the best lace inos Rider in 1127 Yates by 14 like the dominance of the GC teams like you know Yates another UAE Rider there as well and Chone in E Derek G and Ninth and brago that kind of tops out the top in that H as we said green jersey competition it's 376 to 344 the only two people to look at BM G and yasper and the mountains classification we don't see a whole pile of movement in that either with pogacha 77 yonas 58 Remco 42 abrahamson 36 if yonas wanted to get something out of this race he could potentially get the mountains classification out if he turned his Focus to up but a two-time winner the tour France is not going to turn his Focus to the mountain yeah a lot of people were saying online that it was kind of like a bit embarrassing that yonas had to wear the the polka dot the other day kind of like Tad's leftovers which I don't really agree with it's a very very highly highly sought after Jersey but yeah I don't think so I think it's a stupid Jersey cuz it's not the best climber in the race like should be the yellow Jersey well you can see I mean it's basically the exact same people I feels like a consolation prize yeah get that reward you get in football when you're like pretty bad most improved never got that uh so yeah we're looking forward to getting back into uh bit of climing tomorrow and hopefully we'll see a little bit of GC action and maybe a last roll of dice from us can't wait and we'll be back tomorrow yeah with our commitment to go live every day for the rest of the Tour of France and maybe the Welter who knows oh ran thank you for tuning in to another Tour of France reaction show we're going to be back again tomorrow with more reaction to tomorrow stage if you can't wait that long there's another video up here which I know you're going to love and please take a second to subscribe to the channel that really helps more than you know
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